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[Beta] Dreadnaught layouts |
Krim {C?}
Marshal
Galactic Navy
Joined: June 24, 2002
Posts: 362
From: Boston MA
|  Posted: 2011-05-23 15:21
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On 2011-05-23 15:16, Fleet Admiral Maxwell House wrote:
I just used the SD in beta on Ida. I couldn't even take ONE building with all the salvos. |
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Does the PSM still have splash damage against other buildings? doesn't it damage alot of buildings at once?
I'm probably just confused by something I read once
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Dakili
Fleet Admiral
Joined: June 07, 2007
Posts: 86
From: Quebec
| Posted: 2011-05-23 15:24
Havent looked. But wasn't even killing one of the buildings. Tried differents buildings but didn't work. Only thing I know is I popped the pop to 20.
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MrSparkle
Marshal
Joined: August 13, 2001
Posts: 1912
From: mrsparkle
| Posted: 2011-05-23 15:52
Lag won't cause the low damage, it will cause the HP to change almost as if it was being repaired.
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Talien
Marshal
Templar Knights
Joined: May 11, 2010
Posts: 2044
From: Michigan
| Posted: 2011-05-23 16:21
No, the PSM no longer has splash, or if it does it's so low you don't even notice it. The Factory I was launching them at had other structures close to it and none of them were damaged at all, nor was any of the nearby infantry.
I didn't check the population, but if all they're good for is killing pop then you'd get better results with an ECMed Bomber Frigate using neutrons.
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CM7
Midshipman
Faster than Light
Joined: October 15, 2009
Posts: 1812
| Posted: 2011-05-23 16:24
siege dread is worlds better than the bomber dread...
idk what your on about. Has two more bays, more armor, more lasors (i think.)
you all do know you dont have to use PSMs right?
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Okkam
Marshal
Joined: February 06, 2008
Posts: 157
From: Dorset
| Posted: 2011-05-23 17:00
I want to touch again on the idea of two types of shields.
ICC already have two types of shields, however one is barely ever used because while the recharge is fun it is completely pointless recharging quickly if it dies at the drop of a hat. I believe ICC should have some sort of shield varient like the UGTO have armour, one designed to protect against lasers and one to protect against projectiles.
With that being said, I want to also touch on the idea of the seige dreadnaught and the firepower available. Yes it is a decently tanked ship and it might be able to hurt planets, but in the last few tests and usages of the missile dread in the MV i've done on bombing planets it seems that PCM doesn't do jack squat. I find that most of the time my PCM just don't hit the right area of the planet or don't even hit the planet, and even if they do then there is the PD reduction and i'm wondering on the ability of bombers to actually do realistic damage without mass numbers.
The problem with putting numbers into bombing is that it is just easier to take the planet at that point and suffer the pres from bombing the infantry on the planet once it is yours. Honestly, there seems to be little need to bomb planets other than to stop k'luth and ugto depot planets.
I have found it is easier to just drop raize infantry instead of sitting around trying to bomb a planet and possibly destroy a building or two. (unless someone ninja/suicide engineers a new building in its place, which depot planets can handle due to their low low requirements)
Anyone else found this?
[ This Message was edited by: Commander Bjorn (Snafu) on 2011-05-23 17:02 ]
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MrSparkle
Marshal
Joined: August 13, 2001
Posts: 1912
From: mrsparkle
| Posted: 2011-05-23 17:22
There was a time when the rule was "no new gadget suggestions" which meant no new shield types.
That may have changed, and if it did I support swappable shields similar to UGTO armor. Just remember that if a swappable shield has extra energy resistance it would have a penalty to kinetic.
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Talien
Marshal
Templar Knights
Joined: May 11, 2010
Posts: 2044
From: Michigan
| Posted: 2011-05-23 18:46
Quote:
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On 2011-05-23 16:24, Defiance*XO* wrote:
siege dread is worlds better than the bomber dread...
idk what your on about. Has two more bays, more armor, more lasors (i think.)
you all do know you dont have to use PSMs right?
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You're missing the point. Yes you can swap the PSMs out for Mirvs or Neutrons, but it shouldn't be a required thing for everyone to do when they spawn a new Siege Dread simply to replace a nonfunctional weapon with one that actually works. PSMs are quite literally useless, as in useless even against planets with 0% PD. A Bomber FRIGATE will do more damage to a planet than a Siege Dread using PSMs.
I'm hoping it was simply an error with a misplaced decimal point or a 0 left out or something.
Edit: And after some more testing on an ICC planet where I could switch the camera to, I found that PSMs do not even hit a planet before exploding, they usually blow up in space a short distance away but sometimes 1 or 2 out of a salvo will actually hit the target and do damage. Curiously, planetary shields and population are still damaged regardless of whether the PSM blows up in space or hits the planet while buildings and troops are not damaged unless a PSM actually hits them.
[ This Message was edited by: Talien on 2011-05-23 19:08 ]
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SpaceAdmiral
Grand Admiral
Joined: May 05, 2010
Posts: 1005
| Posted: 2011-05-23 19:09
@Soulless
-The slugger faction is the one who gets in close and smacks you until you die. ICC has the shields for it but their weapons dictate range, not close range slamming power.
-UGTO and Kluth can dodge ICC ship weapons, but at a considerably longer range than the range where ICC can dodge(ICC have faster weapons for hitting nimble targets and more manueverability to dodge). This longer range means that falloff hurts. Also, if your weapons are hitting the ICC then he can hit you, but the ICC hitting you doesn't mean you can hit the ICC.
-EAD should win against the AD because the EAD is the slugger faction's sluggiest and most synchronized ship. This synchronization can be compared to the ICC HC which proly benefits the most from no falloff + manueverability + considerable firepower. If you engage at a special range where the distance between your 2 arcs are 10gu-AD has standoffish weapons because torps and ICs are mainly known for their higher speeds than other faction counterparts, giving them a longer effective range. They are still close range, but farther range than what an EAD vs AD engagement usually looks like.
@Defiance
-You have to look at factions at a whole, you don't see me "speaking strictly on CD vs BD here"
-EAD will win at equal numbers vs AD, but what happens if you bring in a dictor and some combat dreads/heavy cruisers/combat destroyers/missile dreads?
-Ablative will make damaging them with cannons harder, but it doesn't matter if the EADs can't hit you.
-UGTO close range weapons ensure you die nicely at close range
-Other Dreadnoughts can kill the EAD, what happened to the infamous MD and the newer CD?
@Talien
-Border cruiser is an HC without torps, but it has EW and more manueverability, making it the long range expert. Just play it as an HC except more careful in maintaining range.
-Both the BD and CD have 1 hcl I believe, maybe to zap small ships/beam sweep cloaked luth?
@Kenny
-The IC is all about speed. (during a month of only using the gunboat dessie I learned the only thing that hit me were ICs and some Rails, but mainly the ICs)
-A big fix would be to fix the delay before firing(there is a delay after pressing the button and firing the first shot).
@People who want 2 shield types
-It won't really matter much, as I beleive current shields have a slight energy resistance already, and UGTO cannons are kinetic and torps are both kinetic and energy, only beams and QSTs are pure energy.
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Talien
Marshal
Templar Knights
Joined: May 11, 2010
Posts: 2044
From: Michigan
| Posted: 2011-05-23 19:51
Quote:
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On 2011-05-23 19:09, SpaceAdmiral wrote:
@Soulless
-The slugger faction is the one who gets in close and smacks you until you die. ICC has the shields for it but their weapons dictate range, not close range slamming power.
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Shields are not for close range, an EAD or Siphon can completely eliminate 100% shields on all arcs with 2 alphas, and that's stock with no enhancements of any kind, and the ICC Dreadnought running defense mode. The only thing shields are good for is soaking the occasional core, cannon, or torp hit when you're firing at something from 600 GU+. Hell, a Parasite can burn 100% of one of an ICC Dreadnought's shield arcs and eat into the armor with one alpha, and a Nymph can take over 50% off one shield arc if all the torps hit. A Scale or TC can pretty well wipe out a full shield arc with one alpha as well. How many Kluth or ICC ships can eat a full armor arc off a UGTO dreadnought with one alpha, even if it's standard armor? We all know Kluth armor is made of tissue paper so yeah they pretty much get hulled with one close range assault alpha too.
Agreed on most of the rest though.
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Brutality
Marshal
Joined: May 25, 2009
Posts: 659
From: Alaska, USA
| Posted: 2011-05-24 00:25
Quote:
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On 2011-05-23 19:09, SpaceAdmiral wrote:
@Soulless
-The slugger faction is the one who gets in close and smacks you until you die. ICC has the shields for it but their weapons dictate range, not close range slamming power.
-UGTO and Kluth can dodge ICC ship weapons, but at a considerably longer range than the range where ICC can dodge(ICC have faster weapons for hitting nimble targets and more manueverability to dodge). This longer range means that falloff hurts. Also, if your weapons are hitting the ICC then he can hit you, but the ICC hitting you doesn't mean you can hit the ICC.
-EAD should win against the AD because the EAD is the slugger faction's sluggiest and most synchronized ship. This synchronization can be compared to the ICC HC which proly benefits the most from no falloff + manueverability + considerable firepower. If you engage at a special range where the distance between your 2 arcs are 10gu-AD has standoffish weapons because torps and ICs are mainly known for their higher speeds than other faction counterparts, giving them a longer effective range. They are still close range, but farther range than what an EAD vs AD engagement usually looks like.
@Defiance
-You have to look at factions at a whole, you don't see me "speaking strictly on CD vs BD here"
-EAD will win at equal numbers vs AD, but what happens if you bring in a dictor and some combat dreads/heavy cruisers/combat destroyers/missile dreads?
-Ablative will make damaging them with cannons harder, but it doesn't matter if the EADs can't hit you.
-UGTO close range weapons ensure you die nicely at close range
-Other Dreadnoughts can kill the EAD, what happened to the infamous MD and the newer CD?
@Talien
-Border cruiser is an HC without torps, but it has EW and more manueverability, making it the long range expert. Just play it as an HC except more careful in maintaining range.
-Both the BD and CD have 1 hcl I believe, maybe to zap small ships/beam sweep cloaked luth?
@Kenny
-The IC is all about speed. (during a month of only using the gunboat dessie I learned the only thing that hit me were ICs and some Rails, but mainly the ICs)
-A big fix would be to fix the delay before firing(there is a delay after pressing the button and firing the first shot).
@People who want 2 shield types
-It won't really matter much, as I beleive current shields have a slight energy resistance already, and UGTO cannons are kinetic and torps are both kinetic and energy, only beams and QSTs are pure energy.
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I agree with a lot of this except your AD vs EAD comparrison. Currently it takes two alphas to blow clean through all AD's shield energy on all arcs as stated previously. With your reasoning, the AD isn't even an Assault Dread if it can't close range. Another thing is even at range the QST's and Torps on the EAD will still collapse all shields rather quickly compared to damage done to the EAD. Im not complaining about lack of AD damage, all im trying to say is that The AD Should be able to take more damage than it currently can. its rediculous.
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Kenny_Naboo
Marshal
Pitch Black
Joined: January 11, 2010
Posts: 3823
From: LobsterTown
| Posted: 2011-05-24 01:22
The way I see it...
Kluth has the strongest weaps, weakest armor.
UGTO has the strongest armor... so can we arrange for them to have the weakest weaps? 
ICC seems to be the middle faction now.
Better def than Kluth, not as good as UGTO.
So let's power up their weaps while nerfing the QSTs and PTs?
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Brutality
Marshal
Joined: May 25, 2009
Posts: 659
From: Alaska, USA
| Posted: 2011-05-24 01:36
Quote:
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On 2011-05-24 01:22, Kenny_Naboo[+R] wrote:
The way I see it...
Kluth has the strongest weaps, weakest armor.
UGTO has the strongest armor... so can we arrange for them to have the weakest weaps?
ICC seems to be the middle faction now.
Better def than Kluth, not as good as UGTO.
So let's power up their weaps while nerfing the QSTs and PTs?
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how does the AD fit into this then?
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Kenny_Naboo
Marshal
Pitch Black
Joined: January 11, 2010
Posts: 3823
From: LobsterTown
| Posted: 2011-05-24 03:15
Quote:
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On 2011-05-24 01:36, FA-Tony*RO* wrote:
how does the AD fit into this then?
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More firepower than EAD, less def/armor than EAD.
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Dakili
Fleet Admiral
Joined: June 07, 2007
Posts: 86
From: Quebec
| Posted: 2011-05-24 03:21
Quote:
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On 2011-05-24 03:15, Kenny_Naboo[+R] wrote:
Quote:
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On 2011-05-24 01:36, FA-Tony*RO* wrote:
how does the AD fit into this then?
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More firepower than EAD, less def/armor than EAD.
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I hightly doub't anyone except ICC would like your idea Kenny. The thing is, ICC is supposed to be the defensive faction.
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