| Author |
ICC whats become of it.......? |
Winters Rapture
Fleet Admiral
United Nations Space Command
Joined: December 09, 2007
Posts: 355
|  Posted: 2009-10-12 01:19
Quote:
|
On 2009-10-11 23:16, Pakhos wrote:
allow moding and also give icc the ability to fire all their weapons backward. So as defensive , icc can run but at least FIRE!
|
|
I think we have just found the awnser to all of our ICC problems. Pakhos, You are a Genius!
_________________
Time for revenge. . .
|
Enterprise
Chief Marshal
Joined: May 19, 2002
Posts: 2576
From: Hawthorne, Nevada
| Posted: 2009-10-12 01:19
Quote:
|
On 2009-10-11 16:32, Jim Starluck wrote:
This is already the case. ICC guns have a flat damage at all ranges, because they are projectiles--their damage is derived from the kinetic energy they hit with, which doesn't change over distance. What this means is that while Particle Cannons and Psi Cannons do greater damage at close range, that damage decreases with range--while damage from Railguns and Gauss Guns doesn't. Past a certain point--and I'm not sure where this is exactly--Railguns and Gauss Guns inflict greater damage than Particle or Psi Cannons.
|
|
But, UGTO and Kluth get far more powerful the closer they get, which happens to be alot easier than keeping distance.
And while ICC do get an advantage for actually managing to keep their distance (less damage taken), this is made fairly pointless by the fact that ICC railgun damage is still pretty low to begin with. This isn't neccessarily a big problem but...
Quote:
|
ICC already have the fastest projectiles in the game in the form of Gauss Guns. Railguns are also, IIRC, faster than their factional counterparts.
|
|
Even with this, at ranges where the advantage of railguns over particle/psi actually become relevant, railgun shots can easily be dodged still. They might be faster, but not by nearly enough.
I've always envisioned a sort of rocket propelled shot for railguns, which would at least better explain it than as a simple mass driver is all that they've come up with. The basic idea being the more distance that is traveled, the faster the shot becomes and the more damage it does.
-Ent
_________________
|
Dilandu
2nd Rear Admiral
Joined: October 05, 2009
Posts: 14
| Posted: 2009-10-13 17:15
Agree with Ent here.
My two cents:
Obvious unbalance in ICC ships. Every faction has few signature combat ship for each class, ICC dosen't.
Scout: NONE(k), assult Sc(u), NONE (i)
Frigate: Beak (k), Intercept(u), NONE(i)
Dressy: Claw/stinger(k), Gunboat (u), Combat (i)
Cruiser: Scale(k), BattleC(U), NONE(i)
Dread: Mandi/Siphon/Krill (k), BD/ EAD(U), AD*(i)
Station: Nest(k), Battle S(U), NONE(i)
If anyone ask why not ICC heavy cruiser: i've out fought at least 3 or 4 of these (player) in a Kluth dressy last week. it's only got 3 guns facing forward!!!
If anyone ask why not ICC assult cruiser: i will slap u silly right now, that USED to be my favorate ship, until it got butchered
Combat Dread is a joke, armor and shield are less than a mandi
MD: it's the first thing anyone JUMPS, write a will before u drive one.
Line station: who dares to fly one in to combat? weakest of combat station of all three factions. Stations=tough b/c they got reloads that repair armor DURING combat, icc station=> shields ........@#$%^&!!!
AD's got a * on it, b/c apparently braiche thinks it only suppose to be used on kluth.
[ This Message was edited by: Dilandu on 2009-10-13 17:29 ]
_________________
|
Sens [R33]
Admiral
Joined: September 27, 2008
Posts: 1020
From: Edge of th...
| Posted: 2009-10-13 17:45
After playing as K'luth I have come to the conclusion that most ICC pilots do not commnicate, do not understand their ships, or simply don't work together. In this version; the ICC actually requires more teamwork than even kluth to play properly. The HC, AC, and Combat Dreadnaught are solid ships when used in conjunction. This does not mean jumping into combat like madmen; it means supporting each other, Assault cruisers gaurding the CD and jumping in to finish off soft targets; heavy cruisers strafing around the enemy to draw attention, and the Combat Dreadnaught providing fire support. ICC thrive off of tactics; they are not close range brawlers. The use of interdictors and Electronic Warfare ships is nearly Necessary for an effective fleet as opposed to the UGTO and K'luth with ships designed to do nothing more than jump in up close and let loose hell or perform surgical strikes. No, the ICC have to be in control of the battle field as well as their ships; more often than not, an ICC ship will lose to a counterpart from another faction up close, but from a range with proper support, even a smaller ICC force can decimate a larger one.
_________________
Proud member of the Order of the Gaifen
Founder and former Club chair of the Shigernafy Fan Club
Co-founder of the Doran Judication Comittee
![Email Sens [R33]](http://www1.palestar.com/gamecq/phpBB/images/email.gif)
|
Supertrooper
Marshal
Pitch Black
Joined: March 18, 2004
Posts: 1895
From: Maryland, U.S.A
| Posted: 2009-10-13 18:22
Quote:
|
On 2009-10-13 17:15, Dilandu wrote:
Agree with Ent here.
My two cents:
Obvious unbalance in ICC ships. Every faction has few signature combat ship for each class, ICC dosen't.
Scout: NONE(k), assult Sc(u), Sensor (i)
Frigate: Beak (k), Intercept(u), NONE(i)
Dressy: Claw/stinger(k), Gunboat (u), Combat (i)
Cruiser: Scale(k), BattleC(U), Assault Cruiser(i)
Dread: Mandi/Siphon/Krill (k), BD/ EAD(U), AD*(i)
Station: Nest(k), Battle S(U), Support(i)
|
|
Fix'd
_________________
|
Dilandu
2nd Rear Admiral
Joined: October 05, 2009
Posts: 14
| Posted: 2009-10-13 19:45
Quote:
|
On 2009-10-13 18:22, Captain Crim wrote:
Quote:
|
On 2009-10-13 17:15, Dilandu wrote:
Agree with Ent here.
My two cents:
Obvious unbalance in ICC ships. Every faction has few signature combat ship for each class, ICC dosen't.
Scout: NONE(k), assult Sc(u), Sensor (i) <= Energy, ammo
Frigate: Beak (k), Intercept(u), NONE(i)
Dressy: Claw/stinger(k), Gunboat (u), Combat (i)
Cruiser: Scale(k), BattleC(U), Assault Cruiser(i) <= ur kidding right?
Dread: Mandi/Siphon/Krill (k), BD/ EAD(U), AD*(i)
Station: Nest(k), Battle S(U), Support(i) <= read what i said about icc stations
|
|
Fix'd <= NO
|
|
_________________
|
Pakhos[+R]
Chief Marshal
Pitch Black
Joined: May 31, 2002
Posts: 1352
From: Clean room lab
| Posted: 2009-10-13 21:27
DS forum is an annoying discussion platform where real players deny what unsubed and developers say,and wiseversa.
And i cant still believe that i am still reading comments like there is no teamwork.
Look people , i am typing those who played kluth more than 8 years. If people says there is something wrong about it and posts 500 times same topic with different names, then yes, there is a problem.
I will not go with details like shields , energy , range etc.. Simply ICC is broken and what playerbase is need to hear is , ok guys we are looking into it , seriously. Otherwise , if any dev member needs to understand what is wrong about icc , please contact me with your address and i will send you first class ticket to afganistan, which will clarify your doubts about being unbalanced.
So cut the crap and work on it !
_________________
* Josef hands [PB]Quantium the Golden GothThug award for best melodrama in a miniseries...
[-GTN-]BackSlash: "Azreal is a master of showing me what is horribly broken in the game."
|
Shigernafy
Admiral
Joined: May 29, 2001
Posts: 5726
From: The Land of Taxation without Representation
| Posted: 2009-10-13 21:43
ICC are fine.
(just posting that to give Pakhos an aneurysm)
_________________
* [S.W]AdmBito @55321 Sent \"I dunno; the French had a few missteps. But they're on the right track, one headbutt at a time.\"
|
Sens [R33]
Admiral
Joined: September 27, 2008
Posts: 1020
From: Edge of th...
| Posted: 2009-10-13 21:45
Quote:
|
On 2009-10-13 21:43, Shigernafy wrote:
ICC are fine.
(just posting that to give Pakhos an aneurysm)
|
|
I concur.
(just quoting this to give Pakhos an aneurysm)
_________________
Proud member of the Order of the Gaifen
Founder and former Club chair of the Shigernafy Fan Club
Co-founder of the Doran Judication Comittee
|
Supertrooper
Marshal
Pitch Black
Joined: March 18, 2004
Posts: 1895
From: Maryland, U.S.A
| Posted: 2009-10-13 22:10
Quote:
|
On 2009-10-13 21:27, Pakhos wrote:
And i cant still believe that i am still reading comments like there is no teamwork. |
|
Me too, I'd figure someone would learn what the hell teamwork is by now.
Quote:
|
Look people , i am typing those who played kluth more than 8 years. If people says there is something wrong about it and posts 500 times same topic with different names, then yes, there is a problem. |
|
When it's the same group of players saying it (Not the entire community, just four people), then there is no problem. I've actually played in the past week, several times actually, and all my times on ICC I've been rather dominant when working with a team. So, I'm willing to bet that the ICC's "problems" are player made.
So yes, ICC are just fine. The players on the other hand just suck.
_________________
|
Light404
Grand Admiral
Joined: May 10, 2002
Posts: 54
| Posted: 2009-10-13 22:27
My only complaints with ICC is the lack of energy. To give specific examples
-none of our ships can have active shields on and fly at more than 1/2 of total speed in stock form, problem SLIGHTLY alleviated with PFEs
-forget about using an AD or AC, 2 alphas and they out of energy
-line stations have epicly low power generation for what they are armed with, support stations arent as bad but still bad)
as stated on the first page we are apparently getting more reactors, and supply bases/ships that regen shields would really take care of the last little bit of balance issues IMO, so I'm pretty content.
However, my view of things could be distorted a wee bit because my ships are uber pimped out with enhancements (when my HC was capped and I had to fly a reg one to destroy it, it felt like I was flying a space born piece of crap), and I don't fly regular ships as a result
I've noticed that even though the bulk of ICC are flying heavy cruisers (onyl one or two of us have subbed so far... waiting for more people to return I geuss), when theres 4 or 5 of us I've seen so far that we are a pretty good force to be reckoned with, except when we tried jumping a ugto fleet of a battle station, 2 dreads and some cruisers; that was a baaad idea lol
[ This Message was edited by: Light404 on 2009-10-13 22:34 ]
_________________
|
Doran
Chief Marshal
Galactic Navy
Joined: March 29, 2003
Posts: 4032
From: The Gideon Unit
| Posted: 2009-10-13 22:55
Quote:
|
On 2009-10-13 21:45, Classy wrote:
Quote:
|
On 2009-10-13 21:43, Shigernafy wrote:
ICC are fine.
(just posting that to give Pakhos an aneurysm)
|
|
I concur.
(just quoting this to give Pakhos an aneurysm)
|
|
ditto
(just replying because Pakhos hates me)
_________________
|
Supertrooper
Marshal
Pitch Black
Joined: March 18, 2004
Posts: 1895
From: Maryland, U.S.A
| Posted: 2009-10-14 03:42
Ugh, here.
Run down of ICC Items, and what they're good for:
Railgun - Long range, energy efficient, and no falloff to damage. Does come with ammo, but that won't matter. Use this at long range, thats what it's best at.
Gauss Cannon - Long range, low damage, and the least taxing on energy. You'll get alot of accurate hits here, and you can use them at extreme ranges. Good for sniping targets under ECM coverage.
Fusion Torp - Another long range weapon. Lots of ammo, good damage, and low on energy. Good for any range, just make sure you're good at hitting moving targets.
IT Missle - The last of the long range weapons to use. Good damage, tracks, and rather low on energy. (Except for the Missle Dread)
Reactive Shields - In my honest opinion, the best options for shields. These have a very high HP%, and they can take alot of damage. They recharge fast, and drain a good bit of energy..
Active Shields - These have a somewhat low HP%, so they can't for tank alot of damage. They recharge slowly, and consume low ammounts of energy when recharging. These are for short bouts and when you need to get in and out without dieing.
PFE Drives - Use these on every ship. They give you alot of extra energy you have to have. They'll reduce your speed, but you don't need speed. All you need to know is how to dodge fire using the ICC's better turning speeds.
ECM - Alright, so why is this important? ICC are a long range faction for the most part. And Missle dreads and sniper ships (Combat Dread, Border Cruiser) are awesome when hidden under ECM firing the extreme range weapons. (Gauss and Missles)
I'm not even going to mess with destroyers and scouts for this, if you can't do anything with them you just suck at Darkspace.
Let's start with cruisers:
Heavy Cruiser - This is the workhorse of the ICC fleet. It's the most well rounded ship. I would suggest using active shields on this. They've got slower reload and less energy use, giving you a good bit of energy to use. The heavy cruiser is about long to mid range. What I've seen out of everyone who complains that this ship sucks, it's because they're trying to make it a close range ship. Use the missles and railguns to they're advantage. Railguns have almost as good as damage as Particle Cannons and PSI have, with no falloff in damage. Meaning you get out at a range, and you use it. I've fought in this in .483, and dominated at the job I was supposed to be doing.
Border Cruiser - This is basicaly a remodeled version of the .482 Heavy Cruiser, utilizing long and mid range weapons, and even a fighter. I'd change the fighter out for the EWAS when fighting K'luth, trust me on that. Once again, don't ever try and make this a close range ship. It's got long range weapons on it for a reason. And again, use active shields on this for easier energy management.
Assault Cruiser - The hammer of the ICC fleet. Not to be used in long term fights, but when the opportunity to dish out heavy damage to a target in a short ammount of time. Never ever use this ship for more then five minutes in a fight if you aren't a skilled pilot, or you will get your ass kicked. Stay within 200-300gu of your target, and take your shots carefully. Use reactive shields on this, you're going to burn through energy anyways, and the quicker recharge for your shields will help you stay alive long enough to jump away when you've done your job.
And now for Dreads:
Combat Dread - This is the mainstay of the ICC dread fleet. While it can be used at close range for short periods of time, I wouldn't try it. Keep at a good distance from your target and circle them, this way you can fire the brunt of your ships weapons. You'll have the most cannons and missles you can fire doing this, and trust me, they will hurt what ever your shooting at. Use actives on this, like the HC and BC. You'll have more energy to use in a long term fight, always important.
Missle Dread - Alright, there are many flaws with this ship, everyone knows it. But there is a way to make it an effective target. Stay 2-3k away from any target, and have ECM on. Deactive your shields if you're quick enough to turn them back on when an enemy spots you. But with ECM on, you should have a rather low sig, or even a negative one. Try and get someone to cover your aft. Use reactive shields for this. Keep them off when you don't need them, and turn them on when you do. This way you can use the extra recharge on shields to hold out until your drive is ready to go.
Assault Dread - The big brother of the Assault Cruiser. Never ever use this more then five minutes in a fight either, anything more and you're asking to die. Get in, alpha the hell out of your target, then get the hell out. Thats the ADs purpose, and there is no other way to fly it. Use rective shields, so you can use that extra recharge to save your ass.
And for Stations:
Supply Station - Read the name. It isn't a combat station, it isn't a command station. Stay the hell away from any kind of combat. Sit more then 20k away from the fight, you don't need to be at a planet. You're only job in this ship is to resupply your faction. Use reactive shields, you're a station, you'll need the extra HP, and you won't worry about energy.
Sector Command - As the name says, this is a command station. Not a combat station. It's best for this station to sit at a friendly planet, or atleast 20k away from the fight at all times. There is no reason what so ever for this station to be brought directly into the fray. Sit back and hand out the orders, thats your job here. As with the Supply, use reactive shields.
Line Station - This is the combat station. There are two different ways I go about using this. Stay around 10k away from the fight. Far enough to where you might not be a main target, but you likley will be. Send pot shots towards the fight and use the long range weapons you have. Use active for this option, if you're not going to be in the middle of the action this will help you out. For option two, this is where you're going to the mess of it all. Straight into the middle of the fight. You come in with a fleet, never alone, with your guns blazing. Fire at the most important targets here, stations and dreads, let your fleet handle smaller priorities. Use reactives for this option, you'll have the recharge to fall back on. As for all stations, rotate away from the fire coming at you, try and take it on all sections of your ship.
[Edit] - Hahah, got the two mixed up didn't I? Thats what I get for writing it at three am.
[ This Message was edited by: Captain Crim on 2009-10-14 13:09 ]
_________________
|
JBud
Marshal
Joined: February 26, 2008
Posts: 1900
From: Behind you.
| Posted: 2009-10-14 03:58
Quote:
|
On 2009-10-13 22:55, Doran wrote:
Quote:
|
On 2009-10-13 21:45, Classy wrote:
Quote:
|
On 2009-10-13 21:43, Shigernafy wrote:
ICC are fine.
(just posting that to give Pakhos an aneurysm)
|
|
I concur.
(just quoting this to give Pakhos an aneurysm)
|
|
ditto
(just replying because Pakhos hates me)
|
|
I agree aswell
(just replying so Pakhos an aneurysm)
Also, my honest player opinion:
ICC are fine. I play as ICC alot, I find they have the best advantage at range, for instance in a combat dreadnought you can stay roughly 1700 GU away, and fire full volleys of ion cannons and railguns if you keep range you can do tons of damage while you get little to none, out of range of their primary weapons.
[ This Message was edited by: JBud on 2009-10-14 04:11 ]
_________________
[-Point Jumper-][-Privateer Elite-][-Summus Dux-][-Praeclarae-]
[img(RIP MY SIGNATURE DELETED AFTER 7 YEARS/img]
''Insisto Rector - Suivez le Guide - Tempus hostium est''
|
Eledore Massis [R33]
Grand Admiral
Templar Knights
Joined: May 26, 2002
Posts: 2694
From: tsohlacoLocalhost
| Posted: 2009-10-14 07:48
Quote:
|
On 2009-10-14 03:42, Captain Crim wrote:
Ugh, here.
Reactive Shields - In my honest opinion, the best options for shields. These have a very high HP%, and they can take alot of damage. They recharge slowly, and do not drain a lot of energy.
Active Shields - These have a somewhat low HP%, so they aren't for tanking damage. They recharge very fast, and consume alot of energy when recharging. These are for short bouts and when you need to get in and out without dieing.
... |
|
Haven't played since 1.516? or just not yet used to em.
Anyhow plz update yer text plz, it looks good enough to put in the "Tactics & new Players" forum...
[b]1.516 - Release[/v]
- Refactored ICC shields:
- * Active Shields now have similar HP to Standard Armor, +20% comparative HP recharge rate, high energy upkeep cost, and low charging energy cost.
- * Reactive Shields have 50% of the hit points of Actives, +100% recharge rate, 50% energy upkeep cost, and 3x the recharge energy cost.
- * Auxiliary Shields have approx. 30% total hit points of Reactive Shields, +50% HP recharge rate, 25% energy upkeep cost, and 2x the recharge energy cost.
AKA
Actives create a massive wall of energy but re-charge slower and have low energy cost
Reactives create a basic/weak defense screen but is able to re-enforce that screen fairly quick, but uses lot of more energy.
_________________
DS Discordion
|
|
English
Deutsch
Nederlands
)
