On 2009-10-14 12:38, Light404 wrote:
How is that people can give advice on how to play ICC when

A) They don't play ICC
B) They don't even understand how the shields work? If you get the differences between active shields and reactive shields wrong in a post, then you don't understand the basics of ICC.

Having said that, Crim your guide is *mostly* accurate with exceptions of you only use the border cruiser if there is NOTHING else you could possible play, The sector command base should only be used if you are out, on your own capping planets,

and I'd take the support station over a line station for in your face combat against the enemy any day of the week. 12 it missles do a lot of damage (sabots can also be used effectively), and the 3 repair drones more than make up for any comparitive weaknesses against a line station. Also, a line station will run out of energy in about 3 minutes, whereas a support can go on for significantly longer.

Stations take active shielding, plain and simple, you need the extra HP and a station will be shot so much the regen advantages of reactives will never take effect.

No one with any modicum of experience would equip their ship with just ONE kind of shield, reactives and actives are designed to complement each other, reactives gen energy and you flip that onto the actives where you should be taking all the damage

On 2009-10-14 13:18, Captain Crim wrote:

Quote:

No one with any modicum of experience would equip their ship with just ONE kind of shield, reactives and actives are designed to complement each other, reactives gen energy and you flip that onto the actives where you should be taking all the damage

Like, active on the aft/fore and reactives on the sides? I don't get what you mean. I think you still think we can take items like shields and weapons and put them in the cargo, and we can't. Mixing up shields this version can lead to alot of problems if you aren't careful, like certain areas of your ship being alot weaker then others, and if your enemy has one day of experience, they'll know how to exploit your weakness.

And again, this is what I've come up with from playing ICC since 2003, and during .483 and .500 when these ships where upgraded.

On 2009-10-14 13:50, Enterprise wrote:
Basically he means since reactives charge faster you can boost your aft/fore active shields faster.

Personally, I prefer all reactives. Actives may have more HP, but a faster recharge rate means that someone with a hint of dodging experience can keep their shields up alot longer.

Of course, this only best applies to destroyers or cruisers. Use at your own risk.

I've never been a fan of mixing shields on larger ships, because you don't always have alot of control over where you're getting shot at. Play it safe and go 3 Active / 1 Reactive. Thats my vote, you can be fancy if you want to though.

On 2009-10-13 21:43, Shigernafy wrote:

(just posting that to give Pakhos an aneurysm)

On 2009-10-14 20:11, Pakhos wrote:

Quote:

On 2009-10-13 21:43, Shigernafy wrote: (just posting that to give Pakhos an aneurysm)

You are so kind. But remember to take a bath everyday if you dont want people get sick while they are kissing your ass and quoting you.

On 2009-10-15 00:57, Coombie wrote:
alright i think we are getting someware in this thread, to the people who say icc are totaly ballanced go jump in any icc scout and fly top speed see how long it takes to run out of energy ( keep shields on) this is without even fireing a shot or useing ecm/eccm/scanner

this is just 1 examle of icc energy drain.

dont get me wrong I dont think thay are totaly rubbish but thay do need a Minor energy boost.

ps: stop being mean to Pak:)

On 2009-10-15 01:01, Captain Crim wrote:

Quote:

On 2009-10-15 00:57, Coombie wrote: alright i think we are getting someware in this thread, to the people who say icc are totaly ballanced go jump in any icc scout and fly top speed see how long it takes to run out of energy ( keep shields on) this is without even fireing a shot or useing ecm/eccm/scanner this is just 1 examle of icc energy drain. dont get me wrong I dont think thay are totaly rubbish but thay do need a Minor energy boost. ps: stop being mean to Pak:)

Turn cloak on in a K'luth scout, and sit still.

Obvious answer to this is don't go full speed, use the energy you have wisley.

On 2009-10-14 03:42, Captain Crim wrote:
Ugh, here.

Run down of ICC Items, and what they're good for:
Railgun - Long range, energy efficient, and no falloff to damage. Does come with ammo, but that won't matter. Use this at long range, thats what it's best at.

Gauss Cannon - Long range, low damage, and the least taxing on energy. You'll get alot of accurate hits here, and you can use them at extreme ranges. Good for sniping targets under ECM coverage.

IT Missle - The last of the long range weapons to use. Good damage, tracks, and rather low on energy. (Except for the Missle Dread)

PFE Drives - USE THESE ON EVERY SHIP. They give you alot of extra energy you have to have. They'll reduce your speed, but you don't need speed. All you need to know is how to dodge fire using the ICC's better turning speeds.

ECM - Alright, so why is this important? ICC are a long range faction for the most part. And Missle dreads and sniper ships (Combat Dread, Border Cruiser) are awesome when hidden under ECM firing the extreme range weapons. (Gauss and Missles)

I'm not even going to mess with destroyers and scouts for this, if you can't do anything with them you just suck at Darkspace.

Let's start with cruisers:

Heavy Cruiser - This is the workhorse of the ICC fleet. It's the most well rounded ship. I would suggest using active shields on this. They've got slower reload and less energy use, giving you a good bit of energy to use. The heavy cruiser is about long to mid range. What I've seen out of everyone who complains that this ship sucks, it's because they're trying to make it a close range ship. Use the missles and railguns to they're advantage. Railguns have almost as good as damage as Particle Cannons and PSI have, with no falloff in damage. Meaning you get out at a range, and you use it. I've fought in this in .483, and dominated at the job I was supposed to be doing.

Border Cruiser - This is basicaly a remodeled version of the .482 Heavy Cruiser, utilizing long and mid range weapons, and even a fighter. I'd change the fighter out for the EWAS when fighting K'luth, trust me on that. Once again, don't ever try and make this a close range ship. It's got long range weapons on it for a reason. And again, use active shields on this for easier energy management.

Assault Cruiser - The hammer of the ICC fleet. Not to be used in long term fights, but when the opportunity to dish out heavy damage to a target in a short ammount of time. Never ever use this ship for more then five minutes in a fight if you aren't a skilled pilot, or you will get your ass kicked. Stay within 200-300gu of your target, and take your shots carefully. Use reactive shields on this, you're going to burn through energy anyways, and the quicker recharge for your shields will help you stay alive long enough to jump away when you've done your job.

And now for Dreads:

Combat Dread - This is the mainstay of the ICC dread fleet. While it can be used at close range for short periods of time, I wouldn't try it. Keep at a good distance from your target and circle them, this way you can fire the brunt of your ships weapons. You'll have the most cannons and missles you can fire doing this, and trust me, they will hurt what ever your shooting at. Use actives on this, like the HC and BC. You'll have more energy to use in a long term fight, always important.

Missle Dread - Alright, there are many flaws with this ship, everyone knows it. But there is a way to make it an effective target. Stay 2-3k away from any target, and have ECM on. Deactive your shields if you're quick enough to turn them back on when an enemy spots you. But with ECM on, you should have a rather low sig, or even a negative one. Try and get someone to cover your aft. Use reactive shields for this. Keep them off when you don't need them, and turn them on when you do. This way you can use the extra recharge on shields to hold out until your drive is ready to go.

Assault Dread - The big brother of the Assault Cruiser. Never ever use this more then five minutes in a fight either, anything more and you're asking to die. Get in, alpha the hell out of your target, then get the hell out. Thats the ADs purpose, and there is no other way to fly it. Use rective shields, so you can use that extra recharge to save your ass.

And for Stations:

Line Station - This is the combat station. There are two different ways I go about using this. Stay around 10k away from the fight. Far enough to where you might not be a main target, but you likley will be. Send pot shots towards the fight and use the long range weapons you have. Use active for this option, if you're not going to be in the middle of the action this will help you out. For option two, this is where you're going to the mess of it all. Straight into the middle of the fight. You come in with a fleet, never alone, with your guns blazing. Fire at the most important targets here, stations and dreads, let your fleet handle smaller priorities. Use reactives for this option, you'll have the recharge to fall back on. As for all stations, rotate away from the fire coming at you, try and take it on all sections of your ship.

On 2009-10-15 12:04, Dilandu wrote:
First off, applauding Crim for wasting time writing such a long post.
Secondly, majority of your information are severely Outdated.
I know ur a vet, so I can only conclude you have not flown most of these ships since 1.500 came around.

"ammo wont matter", disagree, icc weapon by design do less damg, fire faster, any fight with more than 2-3 engagments u will run out. for the rest, refer to Ent's posts ealier, which i agree with: even a dread can dodge railgun at long range.
FUN Trick: Have a friend fly a dread at 2 gu do the basic Z(zig-zag) pattern, you shoot him from 2000gu away. Guess how much of ur fire actrually hits him? Yah, about 50-65%.

This is 1.483 stuff. Presently there are NO ships capable of doing sniping with ECM, not even MD with 3 ECMs. You'll get a positive(+) signature, with shields off, AUX gen off and dead still. [your gonna say stealth scouts, and i'll laugh]. Only thing this gun is good for is hiting small ships.

All human faction have this, and kluth only needs to cloak to make ALL your missles selfdetonate into nothingness. But that's besides the point:
1.)anything smaller than a dread can dodge missiles. u'll get a 75% hit ratio MAX. [please dont say what if a dumbguy charges me straight, or a runs away straight, or stays stationary like he's got no engines]
2.) Since 1.500, EVERY ship has at least 2-4 Laser/ruptor that can be used for Point def.
3.) Except pure missile ships, the largest salvo ICC ship can throw is what? 4-6 for the Combat dread.
Combine the 3 points above, and you'll find how effective missles are.
NOTE: this is why u see alot HC pilots swaping IT missle for Sabot rockets.

....sigh. This is giving me stress. While i agree PFE is a nessesary evil. They reduce you speed by 33%, they also reduce you accel/decceleration, reduce you cruise speed (highest speed w/o losing power).
In another words, if your wining, you can't chase you target down; if you losing, you can't get away!

Again Outdated Data, yes in 1.483 u can have ECM MD's and such (i had a MD with 6 ECM and all Psi missiles and AMJD, people literally don't know why they are geting hulled). Yeah try the same thing today. Turn all you engines and generators off, shields off, all ECM on, go sit in a nebula. Fire a salvo off....Positive sig? Ugly enemy dreads jumping u while they laugh? ubetcha!

Dessy, yes. Scout, no. why? Scout needs speed, and scout fights lasts a long time. ICC scout dont have the engergy or ammo. (and since they tend to be noobmagnets, skill)

This is what i mean, 1.483 data. 1.500 HC is the only passable crusier for the icc. Even at that it does poorly. HC have what? 3 particle cannon forward, 4 to side? same as a Ugto gunboat dressy. At "long to midrange", are your fusion torps and Cl's gonna help u?

let me give u one piece of data, AntimatterJumpDrive on a Kluth Dread recharges every 40 Seconds. Human Crusier: 50sec.

FUN trick: Jump in. Fly your AC at 15gu (75% for IE, 100% for PFE), Fire 3 Alpha strikes. Thank u very much, i hope u've enjoyed your AC experience, now run and hope that angry Torpedo Cruiser or Scale dont kill you, while you wait in agony for ur jd to charge. Oh wait, it' not charging? The reactive shield's sucked up ALL your power cause ur getting SHOT at?

Ok, I'm sorry for the sarcasim before. If the reader haven't figured. AC was my favorate ship, got abit emotional. Stictly professional from now on. Yeah, CD? Crap. The only dread i can think of that got less armor than you is the Krill, and he's got 7 SIs. As to keeping a good distance and circling: Ugto's got Ablative(-50% dmg), thank god EMP got nerfed(150% dmg to ur shields); and remember what i said about kluth dreads AMJD recharge every 40 sec? Guess how fasts human Dreads charge? a.)1min30 b.)1min 50 c.) 3min d.) It dont matter, too long.

Again, u obviously have not done this since 1.483. I'm satisfied leting the swam of mandis/eads surounding you, eyeing you hungrily, answer for me, the second u jump in 3k. Oh, how long does it take to charge a human JD?

This is the ONLY icc ship i use, and you do have this one right, except PFE and Active on this one, all Aux gen, no Aux shield. do not use ur CL unless target is under 30%hull, HCL only. Get either all Condensers or all Armor/shield enhancements. Act like a KLuth dread who forgot his cloaking device, and his jump drive. Fight Oppurtunisticly, run at the first sign of trouble. If cornered, Face you enemy, fight like hell, and die honorablily.

If u have to use a station for icc, use support or sector command, and jsut swam missiles or fighters. Do not, i repeat, DO NOT, ever fly this thing unless all your enemy are cricaly wounded or something punny. Crim, does the ICC Line station have any weapons that will hit an enemy from 10kaway?

But what's the biggest problem for the icc station: It's got SHIELDS!!!
Station are call stations cause they are stationary. They cannt dodge bullets. Reload are the life blood of stations. Reloads dont work on shields.