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Krill |
Fluttershy
Fleet Admiral
Joined: September 24, 2011
Posts: 778
From: Fluttershy
|  Posted: 2012-04-04 01:52
I was arguing about how under powered this ship is, especially considering the rank (Grand Admiral) and badges needed (All golds).
Of course I was shot down because I'm merely a Vice Admiral and thus have never flown the Krill.
But look at that thing.
The Krill has:
4 Disruptors
4 Stellar Incinerators
8 Heavy Psionic Cannons
The Mandible has:
6 Disruptors
2 Assault disruptors
4 Stellar Incinerators
5 Heavy Psionic Cannons
12 Torpedoes
So what does the Krill have up on the Mandible?
3 extra Psi Cannons.
Really?
Are you gonna sit there looking at that, and tell me the Krill doesn't suck, and that I'm just a VA noob that doesn't know what the hell they're talking about?
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Flux Capacitor
Marshal
Joined: July 30, 2010
Posts: 305
From: the place
| Posted: 2012-04-04 02:29
yep.
krill used to be to good. atm it still got more mid-long range fp then mandy. ppl are not sure if krill need more fp. its an alternative for fighter/missle spam, and its the only dread with a cargo of 6
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Forger of Destiny
Chief Marshal
We Kick Arse
Joined: October 10, 2009
Posts: 826
| Posted: 2012-04-04 02:55
the krill only seems to suck
its the cloaking grand-admiral version of the other faction's ranged attack dreads.
take note, the krill also has an extra rear armor plate compared to mandible (8 vs 7), and kluth armor is very heavy (and costly in layout terms).
then take note further, broadside firepower
the krill got 4 SI and 5 heavy psi cannons on the side, mandible got 2(?) SI, 2 heavy psi cannons and 6 torpedoes on the side.
then comes rear (asswards) firepower.
the krill can shoot 6 heavy psi cannons to the rear, and mandible shoots nothing.
tactics wise, a krill being used like an ICC combat dreadnought will focus 100% ranged firepower on pursuers (side + rear arc attacks), at a range upto 700 gu while running away at 15 gu/s. this results in particle cannons doing low damage to you, and no torpedo being ranged enough to catch up to you. krill vs command dreadnoughts works nicely (640 gu psi cannons vs 560 gu proton torpedoes).
the krill does good vs heavy attack and assault ships, sucks vs stations and fully sucks vs most icc gunships. SIs dont seem to do lot of damage but eat lots of energy.
i agree, the krill could use some reshuffling, but the mandible could use some reshuffling insteade too, because in the end both are balanced and should stay balanced.
jim makes good layouts, makes adorable layouts, and makes wacky layouts...krill is one. the superdread krill was better tho 
p.s. - can some dev pls comment on the comparisons between a torpedo and a heavy cannon (damage, range, accuracy, energy)?
p.p.s. - also pls comment on psi cannon vs particle cannon and railgun
[ This Message was edited by: Toby D Syded on 2012-04-04 02:59 ]
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Kenny_Naboo
Marshal
Pitch Black
Joined: January 11, 2010
Posts: 3823
From: LobsterTown
| Posted: 2012-04-04 03:18
The Krill was nerfed from its former glory of
- 8 SIs
- 8 Heavy PSIs
- God knows how many beams
It used to be a Dread2 hull. After a long history of QQs from the human faction, it was reclassed to Dread1, and half its SIs removed as a result.
To put it honestly, it was OP in its former state. And now its quite underpowered. The badge requirements were supposed to be removed, but the devs have not gotten around to it yet.
The Krill wasn't properly refactored so much as knee-jerk nerfed in response to QQ. The devs didn't have the time to properly look at it, but they had to do something about it.
So, I propose a temporary removal (pending refactoring) of the Krill, as it seems to not serve much of a purpose now. Very few people actually use it after the nerf. Personally, I have 8 Adv Weap Multis on a Krill that I don't use anymore.
The Mandi has more bite at close/med range. The Ganglia does more damage from afar. And the badge/rank requirements don't quite add up.
Edit: Suggestion posted to return Krill back to the 1.5x version.
[ This Message was edited by: Kenny_Naboo[+R] on 2012-04-04 03:24 ]
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Fluttershy
Fleet Admiral
Joined: September 24, 2011
Posts: 778
From: Fluttershy
| Posted: 2012-04-04 04:01
Would it be reasonable to give it 6 SI's?
8 sounds a bit much...
But to nerf the ship to 50% of what it was? yikes.
If they don't want it to have more than 4 SI's, maybe 12 heavy psi cannons then.
I'm just going off the feel of things, but that would seem reasonable for a standoff ship.
EDIT:
Now that you mention the wider attack arcs, that changes things a bit.
[ This Message was edited by: Fluttershy on 2012-04-04 04:17 ]
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CM7
Midshipman
Faster than Light
Joined: October 15, 2009
Posts: 1812
| Posted: 2012-04-04 04:25
would it not be better for you to ask this kind of stuff in the chatrooms rather than ass u me it sucks on a glance?
At first glance, an escort destroyer looks like it would be no mach for a ead. Ead has more armor and firepower than the ed. But if the ed is used correctly, there is nothing the ead can do to stop you from killing him short of jump away.
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Fluttershy
Fleet Admiral
Joined: September 24, 2011
Posts: 778
From: Fluttershy
| Posted: 2012-04-04 05:01
Why is everyone in a dread or station if destroyers are so kickass?
I mean, you can hull a dread with a frigate no problem, why do so many players want to fly these big ships that get hit by everything, but can't hit anything smaller than them?
[ This Message was edited by: Fluttershy on 2012-04-04 05:02 ]
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[ML]RogueAvengerTTV
Marshal
Joined: September 11, 2010
Posts: 300
From: England
| Posted: 2012-04-04 05:32
Quote:
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On 2012-04-04 05:01, Fluttershy wrote:
Why is everyone in a dread or station if destroyers are so kickass?
I mean, you can hull a dread with a frigate no problem, why do so many players want to fly these big ships that get hit by everything, but can't hit anything smaller than them?
[ This Message was edited by: Fluttershy on 2012-04-04 05:02 ]
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Because when 3-4 AD's,EAD's,Siphons all point jump you and alpha your not gonnna last that long 
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The Fridge
Chief Marshal
Templar Knights
Joined: December 13, 2008
Posts: 559
From: In Your Fridge, Eating your Foods.
| Posted: 2012-04-04 05:48
The Krill used to be a Station Dread, it was nerf'd for that reason and shouldn't be returned. ( It was as powerful if not more soo then a Nest)
Everone pretty much agreed on that.
The reason it has less armament then the mandi is because it has weapons with tri-arc's.
Tri-arc's seem to cost twice as much as Duel arc's, That's guess work though.
The mandi has pure frontal firepower, the krill has more broadside firepower.
It's still stronger then the old Combat Dread I'd say having 4 SI compare to 1 IC which in the new model is 2 IC's on a broadside?
[ This Message was edited by: The Fridge on 2012-04-04 05:50 ]
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Kenny_Naboo
Marshal
Pitch Black
Joined: January 11, 2010
Posts: 3823
From: LobsterTown
| Posted: 2012-04-04 06:25
Quote:
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On 2012-04-04 05:48, The Fridge wrote:
The Krill used to be a Station Dread, it was nerf'd for that reason and shouldn't be returned. ( It was as powerful if not more soo then a Nest)
Everone pretty much agreed on that.
The reason it has less armament then the mandi is because it has weapons with tri-arc's.
Tri-arc's seem to cost twice as much as Duel arc's, That's guess work though.
The mandi has pure frontal firepower, the krill has more broadside firepower.
It's still stronger then the old Combat Dread I'd say having 4 SI compare to 1 IC which in the new model is 2 IC's on a broadside?
[ This Message was edited by: The Fridge on 2012-04-04 05:50 ]
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Agreed that the most recent Krill was crazy OP.
And yes I do recall a dev telling me that tri-arc weaps cost more points than dual arcs. Hence the Krill has less weaps due to that fact.
However, most Kluth tend to fight in an assault or hit/run fashion, so I feel that the Krill doesn't need tri-arcs. I propose a return to the 1.5x config minus the rear SI.
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Fluttershy
Fleet Admiral
Joined: September 24, 2011
Posts: 778
From: Fluttershy
| Posted: 2012-04-04 06:46
It is mentioned in the description that it deviates from the typical setup, however I didn't realize that it had a wider attack angle that would allow it to shoot broadside, and even a fair number of weapons pointed aft.
perhaps that window that typically shows a 3D model of the ship would be better off showing the weapon arcs in a top down view.
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Mylith
Grand Admiral
Faster than Light
Joined: July 19, 2011
Posts: 507
From: Hivarin, CD+36*15693
| Posted: 2012-04-04 08:19
Quote:
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On 2012-04-04 02:29, Wemmer and the Veykman wrote:
its an alternative for fighter/missle spam, and its the only dread with a cargo of 6
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No idea where you got that from, my CD has 6 cargo.
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Blackjack [DBL]
Grand Admiral
Faster than Light
Joined: February 25, 2011
Posts: 344
From: The land of venomous reptiles.
| Posted: 2012-04-04 08:41
Quote:
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On 2012-04-04 08:19, Persistance wrote:
Quote:
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On 2012-04-04 02:29, Wemmer and the Veykman wrote:
its an alternative for fighter/missle spam, and its the only dread with a cargo of 6
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No idea where you got that from, my CD has 6 cargo.
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Only Luth dread...
edit: i stand corrected...
[ This Message was edited by: Loyalty *TO* on 2012-04-04 08:53 ]
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Princess Celestia
Marshal
Joined: July 03, 2011
Posts: 165
From: The Crystal Empire.
| Posted: 2012-04-04 08:49
no. the mandi and gang both have a cargo of 6
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Forger of Destiny
Chief Marshal
We Kick Arse
Joined: October 10, 2009
Posts: 826
| Posted: 2012-04-04 09:11
Quote:
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On 2012-04-04 06:46, Fluttershy wrote:
It is mentioned in the description that it deviates from the typical setup, however I didn't realize that it had a wider attack angle that would allow it to shoot broadside, and even a fair number of weapons pointed aft.
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goes a long way to show that you need better people to argue with over chat lol
Quote:
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perhaps that window that typically shows a 3D model of the ship would be better off showing the weapon arcs in a top down view.
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no pls no
too complicated, unnecessary, and wiki will be able to handle it
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