| Author |
[suggestion] wormholes |
Panduh
Grand Admiral
Pitch Black
Joined: June 03, 2007
Posts: 250
|  Posted: 2011-06-25 23:02
ORIGINAL:
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Wormholes with (low by default) energy signatures as an attribute?
Specifically, no more "hi guys wormhole over here" visible to everyone on the nav map stuff, at least, to the enemy.
EDIT:
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- WH are visible to all friendly players.
- WH are invisible to all enemy players who are not within 20k of entry/exit, regardless of energy signature.
- Enemy players will only see a WH entry/exit, not the entire thing.
- Based on the distance between WH entry/exit, a WH entry can only be be used by a single ship before having a cooldown on that specific entry point (greater distance = longer cooldown, etc). An entire WH is two way, however, so cooldowns for entry points are seperate.
- In-system WH have reduced cooldowns for entry points.
- A Station must remain within 300 gu to maintain a wormhole. This means that a Station can travel from one end of the WH to the other, but if it gets to far away from it, the WH closes/dissipates/goes-to-Neverland.
Constructive debate over GAME MECHANICS is appreciated.
NEW EDIT:
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- WH require energy to keep open, but will remain open as long as the device is active and the station remains near enough to an entry point.
- Actual WH device has a cooldown once WH is no longer maintained, ie. the player disables device or moves too far away from a WH entry point. This is to prevent excessive WH leapfrogging.
[ This Message was edited by: Panduh on 2011-06-30 23:45 ]
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Blackjack [DBL]
Grand Admiral
Faster than Light
Joined: February 25, 2011
Posts: 344
From: The land of venomous reptiles.
| Posted: 2011-06-26 20:59
Wormholes are a rip in time and space, that would be rather noticabl. mabye a sig of 100, rather than the 9,999,999,999 it seems to be set at now.
It might be because to reduce workload it counts as a jumpgate, which are visible across the entire galaxy.
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Kenny_Naboo
Marshal
Pitch Black
Joined: January 11, 2010
Posts: 3823
From: LobsterTown
| Posted: 2011-06-26 21:40
Quote:
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On 2011-06-25 23:02, Panduh wrote:
Wormholes with (low by default) energy signatures as an attribute?
Specifically, no more "hi guys wormhole over here" visible to everyone on the nav map stuff, at least, to the enemy.
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But WHs are some kinda space-time phenomena. How can something like that be visible to one side, but not by another?
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*FTL*Soulless
Marshal
Joined: June 25, 2010
Posts: 787
From: Dres-Kona
| Posted: 2011-06-26 21:57
Quote:
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On 2011-06-26 21:40, Kenny_Naboo[+R] wrote:
Quote:
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On 2011-06-25 23:02, Panduh wrote:
Wormholes with (low by default) energy signatures as an attribute?
Specifically, no more "hi guys wormhole over here" visible to everyone on the nav map stuff, at least, to the enemy.
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But WHs are some kinda space-time phenomena. How can something like that be visible to one side, but not by another?
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hes meaning so someone in a different system can't see it on the nav map
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Kenny_Naboo
Marshal
Pitch Black
Joined: January 11, 2010
Posts: 3823
From: LobsterTown
| Posted: 2011-06-27 03:44
Quote:
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On 2011-06-26 21:57, Soulless *ADM* wrote:
Quote:
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On 2011-06-26 21:40, Kenny_Naboo[+R] wrote:
Quote:
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On 2011-06-25 23:02, Panduh wrote:
Wormholes with (low by default) energy signatures as an attribute?
Specifically, no more "hi guys wormhole over here" visible to everyone on the nav map stuff, at least, to the enemy.
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But WHs are some kinda space-time phenomena. How can something like that be visible to one side, but not by another?
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hes meaning so someone in a different system can't see it on the nav map
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That part I got. I'm just wondering how a WH generated by yr side should be less visible to an enemy.
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Panduh
Grand Admiral
Pitch Black
Joined: June 03, 2007
Posts: 250
| Posted: 2011-06-27 10:00
IRL mechanics set aside, WH are useless right now. So I'm saying, if a WH isn't yours and you arent within say, 20k of it, you cant see it.
***EDIT in OP made as of this post.
[ This Message was edited by: Panduh on 2011-06-27 11:24 ]
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Panduh
Grand Admiral
Pitch Black
Joined: June 03, 2007
Posts: 250
| Posted: 2011-06-28 23:06
bump - i revised the idea and was hoping for insights, etc.
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Kenny_Naboo
Marshal
Pitch Black
Joined: January 11, 2010
Posts: 3823
From: LobsterTown
| Posted: 2011-06-29 01:14
Quote:
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On 2011-06-25 23:02, Panduh wrote:
-WH are visible to all friendly players.
-WH are invisible to all enemy players who are not within 20k of entry/exit, regardless of energy signature.
-Enemy players will only see a WH entry/exit, not the entire thing.
-A Station must remain within 300 gu to maintain a wormhole. This means that a Station can travel from one end of the WH to the other, but if it gets to far away from it, the WH closes/dissipates/goes-to-Neverland.
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I like these ideas.
Don't like the cool-off, if I'm reading it right that a WH only allows one ship to pass thru at a time. It shd work as is for it's active duration.
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Eledore Massis [R33]
Grand Admiral
Templar Knights
Joined: May 26, 2002
Posts: 2694
From: tsohlacoLocalhost
| Posted: 2011-06-29 08:12
Quote:
| On 2011-06-25 23:02, Panduh wrote:
-WH are invisible to all enemy players who are not within 20k of entry/exit, regardless of energy signature. |
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All allied contact information is shared.
If there is ONE enemy ship that has "a" object inside its detection range. all other ships of that faction will eventually (synchronization) be able to see that object.
About the Navigation map visibility. I will have to ask about the posibilities. but basically wormholes use the same mechanics as jumpgates. the nav will draw a entry and exit point with a line in between and share these with all clients in the server..
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Kenny_Naboo
Marshal
Pitch Black
Joined: January 11, 2010
Posts: 3823
From: LobsterTown
| Posted: 2011-06-29 08:28
Quote:
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On 2011-06-29 08:12, Eledore ICC Massis [R33] wrote:
Quote:
| On 2011-06-25 23:02, Panduh wrote:
-WH are invisible to all enemy players who are not within 20k of entry/exit, regardless of energy signature. |
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All allied contact information is shared.
If there is ONE enemy ship that has "a" object inside its detection range. all other ships of that faction will eventually (synchronization) be able to see that object.
About the Navigation map visibility. I will have to ask about the posibilities. but basically wormholes use the same mechanics as jumpgates. the nav will draw a entry and exit point with a line in between and share these with all clients in the server..
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But I do like his suggestion that the WH generator ship has to stay within range. Once it moves away or gets zapped, the WH collapses.....
... hopefully in a violent way that kills any ship in transit or within 50 Gus. 
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Panduh
Grand Admiral
Pitch Black
Joined: June 03, 2007
Posts: 250
| Posted: 2011-06-29 16:03
Quote:
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On 2011-06-29 01:14, Kenny_Naboo[+R] wrote:
Quote:
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On 2011-06-25 23:02, Panduh wrote:
-WH are visible to all friendly players.
-WH are invisible to all enemy players who are not within 20k of entry/exit, regardless of energy signature.
-Enemy players will only see a WH entry/exit, not the entire thing.
-A Station must remain within 300 gu to maintain a wormhole. This means that a Station can travel from one end of the WH to the other, but if it gets to far away from it, the WH closes/dissipates/goes-to-Neverland.
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I like these ideas.
Don't like the cool-off, if I'm reading it right that a WH only allows one ship to pass thru at a time. It shd work as is for it's active duration.
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Basically, i'm considering a WH to be composed of three parts: its two entry points, and its 'path'. Each entry point has a unique cooldown, to limit the number of ships going from one end to the other at any given time. That's to offset the fact that an entire WH in my suggestion is invisible to the enemy outside of a certain distance.
Right now, WHs have very limited tactical value and also force the user into making an uncomfortable choice: go through and be very vulnerable, or sit and watch the fireworks.
So, what i'm proposing is to give WH some more attributes to give it some more in-game uses.
By making a WH detectable/undetectable, stealth insertions become an option, without being too overpowered. Cooldowns on entry points and a 20k gu detection distance offset the fact that the enemy wont automatically see it on their nav map.
Furthermore, Stations must remain near the WH to maintain it, meaning, if they want to go through, they can go back if they so choose. However, the cooldown remains in effect, and limits the number of ships that might go back through.
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Kenny_Naboo
Marshal
Pitch Black
Joined: January 11, 2010
Posts: 3823
From: LobsterTown
| Posted: 2011-06-29 22:59
I'll go as far as to say a WH shd be detectable up to 5000 gus only. But I still disagree with the limit on ships going through. A WH is just a tunnel connecting 2 points in space. I don't see how something like that could have some kind of control mechanism.
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jamesbob
Grand Admiral
Joined: August 22, 2009
Posts: 410
| Posted: 2011-06-30 06:39
so while we are doing posts that may require to much coding or are far less likely to be actually done for a couple of years.
why don't we make wormholes SO UNSTABLE that if you decide not to wait theres a 50 percent change your ship goes boom.
now i forget how many suggestions about wormholes has there been.
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Panduh
Grand Admiral
Pitch Black
Joined: June 03, 2007
Posts: 250
| Posted: 2011-06-30 20:38
Quote:
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On 2011-06-29 22:59, Kenny_Naboo[+R] wrote:
I'll go as far as to say a WH shd be detectable up to 5000 gus only. But I still disagree with the limit on ships going through. A WH is just a tunnel connecting 2 points in space. I don't see how something like that could have some kind of control mechanism.
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As mentioned above, discussion about game mechanics, preferably in relation to how they contribute to the game.
I gave a reason for limiting the number of ships going through as well, namely, to provide some risk in transporting massive numbers of ships through a wormhole device in order to offset the new 'detectable' attribute.
Wormholes, by my idea, if positioned correctly will be very hard to spot. Transportation doesn't require a jump and is instantaneous, so lets say you make a chain of wormholes maintained by two or three stations. Well, its very efficient, so long as you aren't detected. And since there's a cooldown on usages, you cant simply instazoom an entire fleet from one system to three systems over.
I suggested this design for wormholes for a reason, and I hope that from now on, if at all, at the discretion of this community, that my idea will meet or further discussion concerning GAME MECHANICS.
[ This Message was edited by: Panduh on 2011-06-30 21:19 ]
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Pimpalicious Nerd {C?}
Marshal
Galactic Navy
Joined: January 15, 2003
Posts: 885
From: Connecticut, USA
| Posted: 2011-06-30 22:29
I like this idea, especially with daisy-chaining multiple wormholes together. The cooldown would be tricky to put into effect without making the wormhole qualify as an obstacle or something during the cooldown period, probably requiring a new section of code that would stop the ship in mid-motion or something which look kind of cheesy. Furthermore, it would probably need a progress bar above it to show the cooldown progress.
Instead of having the cooldown be entirely based on the distance traversed by the WH, why not also add the size of the ship passing through it as a factor. A scout is far easier to transport rapidly than a station, yaddamean?
I also think it would be neat to bring back a variant of the jumpgate screen for a few seconds while in transit, adding a slight complexity of a time factor for traveling through. It would look rather sharp, in my opinion.
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