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Drainer |
Borgie
Chief Marshal
Pitch Black
Joined: August 15, 2005
Posts: 2256
From: close by
|  Posted: 2011-03-24 11:36
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On 2011-03-23 22:08, BackSlash wrote:
Borgie, your beams are surprisingly well-balanced compared to the human counter-parts. Bare in mind they do the exact same damage at 50% range, and 75% less at max.
The issue with beams is across the board, and not localised to any one beam or faction.
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wait is that human beams or luth beams?
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doda *EP5 no longer exception...*
Grand Admiral
Joined: December 11, 2005
Posts: 1012
From: happy land
| Posted: 2011-03-24 11:48
Quote:
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On 2011-03-24 11:36, Borgie wrote:
Quote:
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On 2011-03-23 22:08, BackSlash wrote:
Borgie, your beams are surprisingly well-balanced compared to the human counter-parts. Bare in mind they do the exact same damage at 50% range, and 75% less at max.
The issue with beams is across the board, and not localised to any one beam or faction.
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wait is that human beams or luth beams?
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I think jack is reffering to Heavy/Normal Chem lasers compared to Assault/Normal ruptors. Meaning at 1/2 range chems do the same damage as you. At max range chems do 25% of your damage.
Basically human beams drop off in damage, luth beams dont.
Its the reason why ugto and icc try to fight very close against you luths. Our chems do inredibly high damage at short ranges.
Speaking of which how does a 1v1 alpha compare, say at 300 GU (max ruptor range) and 150 GU.
[ This Message was edited by: doda *EP5 no longer exception...* on 2011-03-24 11:51 ]
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Krim {C?}
Marshal
Galactic Navy
Joined: June 24, 2002
Posts: 362
From: Boston MA
| Posted: 2011-03-24 13:24
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Basically human beams drop off in damage, luth beams dont.
Its the reason why ugto and icc try to fight very close against you luths. Our chems do inredibly high damage at short ranges.
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Kluth decloaks.
Close close close.
I remember when I used to try to get range from kluth, disaster.
Fighting ICC is a gun fight
Fighting Kluth is a knife fight...
..in a dark alley where you don't see your opponent till he already stabbed you in the back 
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Kaepora
Fleet Admiral
Joined: February 08, 2011
Posts: 77
| Posted: 2011-03-24 14:29
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On 2011-03-23 00:42, Kaepora wrote:
The drainer hasn't had an update yet. You're better off with a comparable destroyer class.
In capable hands, a dessie can handle what a dread cannot: a fast moving opponent with lots of cannons and good energy usage. A BD can escape mandible range quickly, because K'luth dreads can't move fast without using lots of energy. But a Claw can keep up easily while going slightly above half speed.
It also manuevers better, thus ensuring you'll stay in thier blind spot.
Now, if the drainer still sucks after the cruiser redo, then we'll have a problem. Till then, the drainer is being worked on right now, so the devs have it under control.
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Whoops, I got parasite and drainer mixed up  . Disregard most of what I said .
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Borgie
Chief Marshal
Pitch Black
Joined: August 15, 2005
Posts: 2256
From: close by
| Posted: 2011-03-24 16:31
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On 2011-03-24 11:48, doda *EP5 no longer exception...* wrote:
I think jack is reffering to Heavy/Normal Chem lasers compared to Assault/Normal ruptors. Meaning at 1/2 range chems do the same damage as you. At max range chems do 25% of your damage.
Basically human beams drop off in damage, luth beams dont.
Its the reason why ugto and icc try to fight very close against you luths. Our chems do inredibly high damage at short ranges.
Speaking of which how does a 1v1 alpha compare, say at 300 GU (max ruptor range) and 150 GU.
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thought so, the way jack posted made me wonder if luth beams also had a fall off.
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Kenny_Naboo
Marshal
Pitch Black
Joined: January 11, 2010
Posts: 3823
From: LobsterTown
| Posted: 2011-03-24 20:25
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On 2011-03-24 09:13, Talien wrote:
Quote:
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On 2011-03-24 00:25, Kenny_Naboo[+R] wrote:
The reason why human beams seem to do more damage to us, is because of our tissue-paper armor. Kluth beams may do a bit more damage. But if you face off against a human ship, expect them to outlast you.
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That's why I keep saying Kluth should have a cannon-heavy Cruiser and Dread, sounds like something perfect for the new Parasite and Krill layouts.
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The thing is that they intended for Kluth to be a close range hit and run faction. So I tend to agree with him that our beams should do more damage (since we ARE beam heavy after all).
In short, if a Kluth, who has much less armor and durability, closes with you to beam range, he should do some real damage with those flashlights.
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Talien
Marshal
Templar Knights
Joined: May 11, 2010
Posts: 2044
From: Michigan
| Posted: 2011-03-28 08:48
Well, an easy way to compare beam damage would be to go in beta with a friend and have one of you in, say, a UGTO SS with standard armor and the other in an AD. Fire at the station with just beams from point blank and take note of the armor/hull value. Back up and do the same from 150 GU and check the armor/hull value again. Switch to a Siphon and fire the same number of beams as you did with the AD, and check the armor/hull value once more.
Suggest doing this at a depot planet with the depots off during each firing test then turn them on for a quick fix after.
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Fattierob
Vice Admiral
Joined: April 25, 2003
Posts: 4059
| Posted: 2011-03-28 09:27
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On 2011-03-24 20:25, Kenny_Naboo[+R] wrote:
The thing is that they intended for Kluth to be a close range hit and run faction.
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In all honesty I have no idea if the intended k'luth design is a close range hit and run faction or just a hit and run faction.
Theirs a huge difference in those two concepts, and I think k'luth are going from the former into the latter now over patchs. More ships with missiles and cannons instead of beam heavy ships with torps (.48x scale, anybody?).
However, that might just be because beams and torps are now "weak" compared to missiles and cannons / the current school of tactics and strategy have changed
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Gejaheline
Fleet Admiral
Galactic Navy
Joined: March 19, 2005
Posts: 1127
From: UGTO MUNIN HQ, Mars
| Posted: 2011-03-28 12:02
I'm reasonably sure that the best engagement range for K'luth ships is their maximum possible beam range. Luth are suitably lethal when it comes to their huge numbers of beam weapons in my opinion, but only when they take advantage of their lack of damage loss over distance.
At actual point-blank range, I'm fairly sure that human ships tend to out-damage K'luth ships, at least when the fight lasts for more than a few seconds.
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Died~2000~Deaths[+R]*CC*
Chief Marshal
Army Of Darkness
Joined: February 08, 2010
Posts: 540
From: Spokane WA.
| Posted: 2011-03-28 13:59
o so y do kluth stations have cloaks there useless,unless im hideing from planets d-fence .players r to smart they know if i cloak in a station where i am. lol station dont move fast enough to dodge nething.
Died~2000~Deaths[+R]™
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Gejaheline
Fleet Admiral
Galactic Navy
Joined: March 19, 2005
Posts: 1127
From: UGTO MUNIN HQ, Mars
| Posted: 2011-03-28 16:20
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On 2011-03-28 13:59, Died~2000~Deaths[+R]™ wrote:
o so y do kluth stations have cloaks there useless,unless im hideing from planets d-fence .players r to smart they know if i cloak in a station where i am. lol station dont move fast enough to dodge nething.
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Because stations aren't front-line combat units. You can't ambush someone with a station.
The benefit of a cloaking device on a luth station is that it can lurk around undetected when it's not doing things like repairing allied ships, making it harder to track them down.
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Kenny_Naboo
Marshal
Pitch Black
Joined: January 11, 2010
Posts: 3823
From: LobsterTown
| Posted: 2011-03-28 20:52
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On 2011-03-28 16:20, Gejaheline wrote:
Because stations aren't front-line combat units.
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Tell that to the Shrooms.... SS and BS. 
Or is that a design flaw? Being able to take on a small fleet on its own.
Fix that first, then get back to us.
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Iwancoppa
Fleet Admiral
Joined: November 15, 2008
Posts: 709
| Posted: 2011-03-28 21:28
Kenny, i declare your post WIN.
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Thernhoghas
Grand Admiral
Exathra Alliance Fleet
Joined: September 18, 2010
Posts: 243
From: somewhere in Germany
| Posted: 2011-03-29 04:29
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On 2011-03-28 21:28, iwancoppa wrote:
Kenny, i declare your post WIN.
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Gejaheline
Fleet Admiral
Galactic Navy
Joined: March 19, 2005
Posts: 1127
From: UGTO MUNIN HQ, Mars
| Posted: 2011-03-29 06:18
Hmm, I suppose I walked right into that one, didn't I?
Not meant to be front-line combat units. Hopefully the redesign will help to sort that one out.
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