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Prestige gain rate |
Specterx
Fleet Admiral
Pitch Black
Joined: December 09, 2001
Posts: 547
From: Virginia/California
|  Posted: 2011-02-15 01:30
In the MV today I was gaining 500-1000 prestige an hour, including the hit from losing a Hive.
Seems a bit fast, to put it mildly. It's been a number of years since I last played so apologies if this has been talked to death already.
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Reznor
Marshal
Joined: March 29, 2010
Posts: 316
| Posted: 2011-02-15 01:40
Basically, you get prestige from doing armor/sheild damage. They've been continually nerfing it since they made the change, but it seems that the gain rates are still much much higher than in the old days.
Dev log is pretty much covered with "Nerfed prestige gain rates from armor/shield damage"  .
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SpaceAdmiral
Grand Admiral
Joined: May 05, 2010
Posts: 1005
| Posted: 2011-02-15 02:30
$50s says there will be another one shortly after mods read this post
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Alcedo
Chief Marshal
*Renegade Space Marines*
Joined: June 03, 2010
Posts: 136
| Posted: 2011-02-15 03:26
Here we go again...
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Dakili
Fleet Admiral
Joined: June 07, 2007
Posts: 86
From: Quebec
| Posted: 2011-02-15 04:50
10$ There will be an other one even if devs don't read this post. 
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BackSlash
Marshal
Galactic Navy
Joined: March 23, 2003
Posts: 11183
From: Bristol, England
| Posted: 2011-02-15 05:29
$100 says I had planned to lower it again.
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Code Red
Chief Marshal
Non Omnis Moriar
Joined: September 08, 2007
Posts: 184
| Posted: 2011-02-15 08:32
Hehe nice one.
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Tommas [ USF HunnyBunny ]
Chief Marshal
Pitch Black
Joined: February 04, 2006
Posts: 581
From: Norway
| Posted: 2011-02-15 08:45
$10 says it wont be enough
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Azure Prower
Chief Marshal
Joined: March 14, 2006
Posts: 309
| Posted: 2011-02-15 10:21
$5 says I'll reach chief marshal by the time it's nerfed.
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JBud
Marshal
Joined: February 26, 2008
Posts: 1900
From: Behind you.
| Posted: 2011-02-16 05:15
Quote:
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On 2011-02-15 08:45, Tommas [ USF HunnyBunny ] wrote:
$10 says it wont be enough
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+1
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Enterprise
Chief Marshal
Joined: May 19, 2002
Posts: 2576
From: Hawthorne, Nevada
| Posted: 2011-02-16 09:07
Quote:
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On 2011-02-15 05:29, BackSlash wrote:
$100 says I had planned to lower it again.
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It wont do a bit of good, and I believe personally it hurts the newbies more than it hurts the vets. Let me explain why. Please keep an open mind about this, I'm being more polite than usual.
See here's the thing. Most newbie ships (frigate-cruiser) do very little volley damage but do alot of DPS over time. That means they do alot of armor and shield damage. You want this to happen. It means they contribute to combat completely regardless of the situation. They wont wait until the enemy is hulled before contributing. You want to keep armor/shield prestige high.
Now what you want to do is realize that the majority of combat presitge is gained through damaging hull. Guess what does that the best? Dreadnaughts against dreads. Or agains stations. They do alot of damage in a short period of time and thus, gain alot of combat prestige for it, even if they themselves get hulled in the process. This is the thing. This is what you should focus on. You shoudl focus on hull damage, the primary gain of combat prestige.
Now to be perfectly honest, I would be happy with the current gain rate if the loss rate was just as big (I can gain 500 prestige off of hulling a dread to 20), but I think dread and station loss prestige should be ramped up hard, especially for high ranking players like me because I will admit this one very important fact that ruins balance altogether:
I can jump in a station, spam spacebar, and still come out in the postitive. And in the rare case I don't, I lose maybe 100 prestige when compared to the 200k prestige buffer I have on Grand Admiral, the maximum requirment for ships.
This has big ramifications. And I want to explain it, really. And like I said, keep an open mind.
The biggest prestige gainers are dreadnaughts and stations because they do alot of burst (volley damage) and they have alot of armor that allows them to stay in combat. The huge fact is, there is alot of hull to be drained, and dreads and stations do the most damage... you see where it leads. Alot of hull damge = alot of combat damage. Its not the armor/shields. They are a minor factor. I believe you've been tackling the wrong thing. You're hurting new players more than you ae old players because I can lose station after station, still be in the postivie, and gain plenty of stats by suiciding because its not armor/shields, its the hull damage. There is alot of hull on ships to be drained, and its easy to get to.
You should not be nerfing armor/shield prestige gain. If anything, you should restore it to its original values so small ships (aka, newbies) have a decent chance of gaining anything at all. Overall, its the dreads that do the insane combat prestige because of hull, not armor/shield damage.
What I feel you should do to best balance out prestige gain is to increase the prestige loss of players that are in the Marshal/Chief Marshal range. Don't mess with anything else just yet, just those two demographics with nothing to lose to but everything to gain. Think about how that affects balance.
When you can jump station after station and still come in the positive. When I can fly a dread in a suicide run and still come in the positive. Its not armor/shield prestige. Its hull prestige. So I think you have two options.
You can either reduce the amount of prestige gained from hull damage, which I think personally is a bad idea, or you can increase the prestige loss from losing a bigger ship (like dreads or stations).
I think if you can gain 500-600 prestige in a single fight, even if you lose, I think the loss should be ramped up enough to make a difference. It should be a risk vs. reward thing. If you have 300k prestige, or 1 million, or 100, it shouldn't matter. Losing a ship should be meaningful enough that people will actually consider their actions before they jump into a fight. Does it prevent combat? No. The reward for good piloting is still there, but it removes suicidal runs.
And it should. If I jump into a fleet with a station, I should be expecting a 3k prestige loss because jesus, I have such a huge buffer at the moment with the way hull damage is, I can throw station after station at players and not worry. Thats bad mechanics and bad balance.
Please, for the sake of the game, increase the prestige loss of dreads and stations. Its the only sensible thing left to do. Don't nerf prestige gain, just increase prestige loss. Everything then will sort itself out naturally.
Why? I think if you're CM, you have earned the weight of your rank. And that weight means that stupid deaths should count against you. Suicidal deaths especially. But if you play smart you don't have to worry. There has to be risk in the game otherwise the reward is meaningless. And there is no risk after you hit GA. Hell, there is no risk once you hit dreads. Is that really balance? To just gain prestige regardless of the circumstances? I don't think so.
I just think, TL;DR, that you should be looking at prestige loss, not gain, as the solution to incredibly high gain rates. Because incredibly high gain rates are a direct link to incredibly low losses. No risk. Substatial reward. Thats all I can really contribute.
-Ent
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Kenny_Naboo
Marshal
Pitch Black
Joined: January 11, 2010
Posts: 3823
From: LobsterTown
| Posted: 2011-02-16 11:15
Have to agree with Ent here.
I noticed a lot of players not afraid of dying in stations and dreads. Pres loss is too low.
Personally, I try not to get killed ingame. Not because of pres loss, but because I would like to get a pretty KD ratio. But as a result of that, I play more "realistically", instead of recklessly.
Increasing pres loss on the field will make dying and dictors something to be feared.
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BackSlash
Marshal
Galactic Navy
Joined: March 23, 2003
Posts: 11183
From: Bristol, England
| Posted: 2011-02-16 16:01
I'll speak to the dev originally responsible for lowering it a fair while back, see if we can't do a bit of increasing and reducing of some stats to help.
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SpaceAdmiral
Grand Admiral
Joined: May 05, 2010
Posts: 1005
| Posted: 2011-02-16 17:48
I agree with ent too, logic behind it is solid.
(note to self: get some buffer pres up!)
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Strategery
Grand Admiral
Sundered Weimeriners
Joined: December 07, 2002
Posts: 522
From: Straight Outta Boston!
| Posted: 2011-02-16 21:41
I agree
I also think supply pres should be re-upped. I can't fathom a reason why it was nerfed, as it's the most thankless job in the game. People can build 20 depots and supply plats, so if a person decides to fly an itty-bitty supply into harms way they should be well rewarded for it.
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