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Concerns about new missiles |
Enterprise
Chief Marshal
Joined: May 19, 2002
Posts: 2576
From: Hawthorne, Nevada
|  Posted: 2010-08-22 07:01
I think PD should definintely be given a miss chance at this point in junction.
-Ent
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Lazurkri
Fleet Admiral
Interstellar Cultural Confederation United
Joined: January 20, 2010
Posts: 37
From: Chilliwack, British Columbia, Canada
| Posted: 2010-08-22 07:46
Why not have missiles with limited shielding?
Anyone here ever read Honor Harrington? There, PD was a big thing, but so was Active jamming and other stuf. The missiles on the other hand, to counter the PD and jamming, had Penetration Aids- IE they could sppof sensors to a degree so a Laser would be shooting at a ghost.
Why not go that way? missiles that are slower, but can spoof PD for a short while? Or why not have missiles with limited shields capable of taking one or two shots before failing? that way theres no way a fleet could just go turtle and pour all their power into PD and eliminate the missiles from a distance.
A concern of mine: Will these new missiles be "smarter"?? God knows, I've fired enough at targets like cruisers and the ones that the cruiser PD doesn't knock down right away miss and circle merrily around the enemy doing jack &%!@*!%~ until the cruiser PD downs them. will this problem be fixed with the new missiles?
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Borgie
Chief Marshal
Pitch Black
Joined: August 15, 2005
Posts: 2256
From: close by
| Posted: 2010-08-22 09:59
problem now is with this improved PD that icc ships are yet again at a handicap to its ugto counterparts. i watched yesterday as several missle dreds and stations firing missles at a ugto fleet and nothing was getting thru. now i find this as to be unfair seeing how everyone will agree spaming missles is what icc does best. exspecially to counter ugto mass station spam.
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BackSlash
Marshal
Galactic Navy
Joined: March 23, 2003
Posts: 11183
From: Bristol, England
| Posted: 2010-08-22 12:23
So much baseless fiction being touted here.
The Pulse Laser, as a lot of ICC are finding out, is very, very powerful. Plus I have no idea where this notion of 'When ICC use missiles, no-one should be able to counter it' came from. PD is the counter to this type of stuff, and whilst it has received a fairly large boost this patch, it will drain your energy in a short period of time if used incorrectly.
A single MD can plow through the front armour of an EAD (a ship with the most beams on UGTO) easily if it doesn't use its HCL's. If you do use them, it's a race against how long the energy lasts until you have to retreat. If you're moving even slightly towards (or away from) the missiles being flung at you, then you're even more at a disadvantage due to energy generation at high speeds.
Yesterday a fleet of about 9 UGTO (even with PD) were forced to jump in close to a fleet of 4 ICC due to the amount of missiles they were putting out.
Before this change a fleet could do very little against a handful of MD's flinging a metric ton of missiles, or any ship for that matter. Now there's a counter, but it comes at a price of energy consumption. This is an acceptable trade, and unless the new PD system puts unnecessary strain on the server, it won't be disapearing anytime soon.
I would suggest those whining about the change in such a childish and un-educated manner, to go in and try it out. To those particular ICC players - just because a faction is better at long range, does not mean it is meant to be the absolute power at long range.
As far as smaller ships go - we give them electronic warfare slots for a reason - try and use them.
- Jack
[ This Message was edited by: BackSlash on 2010-08-22 12:23 ]
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Borgie
Chief Marshal
Pitch Black
Joined: August 15, 2005
Posts: 2256
From: close by
| Posted: 2010-08-22 12:36
thats the problem there jack the count to a force fling md's was to point jump em, kill or force em to retreat. now the staff made it easier for the ugto to counter this problem. once again putting icc at a handicap. i really wish you pull your head outta your ass for once and see what these "changes" really do to the game.
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BackSlash
Marshal
Galactic Navy
Joined: March 23, 2003
Posts: 11183
From: Bristol, England
| Posted: 2010-08-22 12:46
Quote:
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On 2010-08-22 12:36, Fatal Borgie wrote:
thats the problem there jack the count to a force fling md's was to point jump em, kill or force em to retreat. now the staff made it easier for the ugto to counter this problem. once again putting icc at a handicap. i really wish you pull your head outta your ass for once and see what these "changes" really do to the game.
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Ship jumps MD, MD jumps away, continues to fire. That's not a stalemate. A stalemate is what we have now. Should pull your head out of the ground  .
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Gerlach
Marshal
Joined: May 07, 2010
Posts: 78
| Posted: 2010-08-22 12:56
That's what interdictor cruisers are for.
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Wild Cat
Fleet Admiral
Joined: August 28, 2004
Posts: 109
From: The Netherlands
| Posted: 2010-08-22 14:17
Quote:
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On 2010-08-22 12:56, Gerlach wrote:
That's what interdictor cruisers are for.
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I do hope that with the cruiser layout update it will still have a decent amount of PD`s, for as soon as you light up your interdictor your attracting a lot of missiles fire.
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Wild Cat
Dutch Time
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Gerlach
Marshal
Joined: May 07, 2010
Posts: 78
| Posted: 2010-08-22 14:25
Not in close range on top of a station with an army of dreads guarding it.
And I don't think they will mess it up.
[ This Message was edited by: Gerlach on 2010-08-22 14:27 ]
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Rebellion
Marshal
Faster than Light
Joined: June 20, 2009
Posts: 730
From: sol
| Posted: 2010-08-22 14:50
EAD shouldent be able to hold its own agenst a MD at range, the EAD is not a long range ship and its the EAD's fault it got caught in the fireing line.
& small missle ships wont be able to keep up now.
[ This Message was edited by: Grand Admiral CRAZY45 *XO* on 2010-08-23 09:41 ]
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Vice Admiral Josh Knight
Vice Admiral
Joined: July 25, 2010
Posts: 56
| Posted: 2010-08-22 15:15
Yep, there is no reason to even play ICC anymore. The long-range advantage we had is now gone. I think you will start to see lots of ICC players leaving the faction now 
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Lazurkri
Fleet Admiral
Interstellar Cultural Confederation United
Joined: January 20, 2010
Posts: 37
From: Chilliwack, British Columbia, Canada
| Posted: 2010-08-22 16:32
Hence my suggestion about missiles able to spoof PD temporarily....
Also, any word on whether or not they fixed the missiles "Orbiting of Targets" problem? I'm still getting it where I fire at a enemy, and out of ten missiles, 3 hit, 4 get taken out by PD, and the rest get through....and merrily orbit the target until PD kills them.
Another suggestion: I'm sure we've all run into this. You are part of a fleet, and shooting at a enemy, and have a huge amount of missiles inbound towards your target when he either jumps away or explodes, and you still have missiles in the air. Would it be possible to have these "wild missiles" lock on to another enemy ship if they are within, say, 300 GU instead of just flying along and uselessly exploding in space? with these new missiles, since there are going to be less of them carried, even if they are more powerful, any misses will be costly, hence my suggestion of "smarter" missiles able to lock onto new targets if needed
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Eledore Massis [R33]
Grand Admiral
Templar Knights
Joined: May 26, 2002
Posts: 2694
From: tsohlacoLocalhost
| Posted: 2010-08-22 17:43
Quote:
| On 2010-08-22 15:15, Vice Admiral Josh Knight wrote:
Yep, there is no reason to even play ICC anymore. The long-range advantage we had is now gone. I think you will start to see lots of ICC players leaving the faction now |
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Unlike what you Believe! you still HAVE the range advantage.
All the ICC cannons do 100% damage at all ranges.
While ICC have more missiles indeed Use that interdictor, That is 1000gu that they can't point jump you and you get to use that lenght to rain them with missiles and cannons.
ok.Quote:
| On 2010-08-22 14:17, Wild Cat wrote:Quote:
| On 2010-08-22 12:56, Gerlach wrote:
That's what interdictor cruisers are for. |
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I do hope that with the cruiser layout update it will still have a decent amount of PD`s, for as soon as you light up your interdictor your attracting a lot of missiles fire. |
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Interdictor generator + decent amount of PD = energy drainage.
If it where me i would just give it Two full arc pulse beams and some cannons.
But we will have to wait and see what Jim cooks up.
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Vice Admiral Onassi
Vice Admiral
Joined: March 20, 2010
Posts: 44
From: Bridge of the Hot Needle of Inquiry
| Posted: 2010-08-23 03:17
Im glad that the admins responded to all the concerns about ICC being tremendously overpowered. Thank you.
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Antra
Admiral
Agents
Joined: February 16, 2002
Posts: 657
From: Grand Rapids, Michigan
| Posted: 2010-08-23 04:10
Sigh. I guess this is my fault for bringing it up.
New-ish PD: NOT ON TOPIC
Existing layouts for cruisers and larger: NOT ON TOPIC
NEW MISSILES on NEW CRUISER AND LARGER LAYOUTS...which we haven't seen yet.
I was voicing some concerns based on theory and I, like every other player, have not seen the new layouts in use so I don't have anything concrete. That's why the thread title includes the word "concerns" as opposed to "problems with the game" or somesuch.
Just something I wanted the devs to think about if they hadn't already, and I assume that any dev team designing new missiles and layouts would already be thinking about how those new missiles can/should be defended against.
[ This Message was edited by: Antra on 2010-08-23 04:39 ]
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