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Ship Interdictors |
Ants
Chief Marshal
Joined: February 11, 2005
Posts: 315
From: Canada
|  Posted: 2009-11-30 08:58
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On 2009-11-29 12:22, Rocko Willis wrote:
dictor kills the fun... It has is place... but as a defensive weapon system.. to prevent people form getting to you.. say at a gate/station/planet..
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Here’s what I think the Interdictor should be... Two parts to the dictor.
1. Instead of a field the inhibits the ability to jump, make it defensive. So there is a field that will stop a ship jumping in by stopping the jump drive. You are able to jump out of the driver inhibitor.
2. have a cool down ability the discharged the jump drives but a few % to stop the ship for jumping by about 3-5 seconds... on like a 10-15 second cool down?
this will not be an instant death trap. You can still protect your fleet. And if you can judge it right you can get the kill you much desire.
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MrSparkle
Marshal
Joined: August 13, 2001
Posts: 1912
From: mrsparkle
| Posted: 2009-11-30 10:01
Perfect, that's pretty much the way I want ship dictors to work. Can't jump in to the field, but can jump out with a longer jumpdrive time.
But is it doable?
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Viskel the Muffin Muncher
Grand Admiral
Joined: November 13, 2009
Posts: 38
From: Your Fridge
| Posted: 2009-11-30 10:56
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On 2009-11-30 10:01, MrSparkle wrote:
But is it doable?
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I highly doubt it. If we allow them to jump 'out' once they are inside that bubble, what is to stop them from just jumping from one point in that bubble to another point inside the bubble? It'll still allow point-jumping, just you'd have to be within the bubble.. But point-jumping is most often done by the ships nearby already, so it wouldn't really stop anything..
And based off of my experience modding other games, I don't think it would be possible even in the basic idea. To stop you from jumping into, but allow jumping out, the dictor field would have to run a check on every ship's jump. Is ship Z entering field X, where X is 1000gu of ship Y? If yes, stop jump of ship Z at 1000gu to ship Y.
Something like that is the only thing I can think of that would make it work, and that would just be a lag magnet, as the server would have to analyze every jump being made to see if it is going to enter a dictor bubble, as well as tracking every dictor field that is up, and comparing them.. Furthermore, then you could set your destination past the field, and manually drop jump to be dropped out inside of that field.
The people doing DS know more than me on this, I just don't think it would work.. I personally don't see that much of a problem with it anyway, they are paperthin and extremely easy to kill, save the Kluth ones, which if cloaked can't be used offensively anyway.. Increasing energy usage won't work, as they already drain the ICC dictor dry in a minute if the shields are trying to recharge. The only thing I can think of is reduce the field range from 1000gu to 500-750gu. It'll at least stop PJing close enough to alpha strike, they'll still need to cover distane for that, though they will be close enough for cannons and railguns.
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Fatal Afro Man *NCO*
Marshal
Fatal Squadron
Joined: September 09, 2006
Posts: 201
| Posted: 2009-11-30 11:26
orrr.... we could just cut the dictor cruiser's speed in half? if it can't chase you than it can't really be used offencivly, unless ur in a station.... But if your in a station by yourself then your going to die anyways.
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Ants
Chief Marshal
Joined: February 11, 2005
Posts: 315
From: Canada
| Posted: 2009-11-30 11:41
[quote]
On 2009-11-30 10:56, Viskel wrote:
[quote]
On 2009-11-30 10:01, MrSparkle wrote:
But is it doable?
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I highly doubt it. If we allow them to jump 'out' once they are inside that bubble, what is to stop them from just jumping from one point in that bubble to another point inside the bubble? It'll still allow point-jumping, just you'd have to be within the bubble.. But point-jumping is most often done by the ships nearby already, so it wouldn't really stop anything..
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If you are in the dictor field we already see you and are in combat. The field is meant so a fleet can just jump on your fleet from 10kgu away.
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And based off of my experience modding other games, I don't think it would be possible even in the basic idea. To stop you from jumping into, but allow jumping out, the dictor field would have to run a check on every ship's jump. Is ship Z entering field X, where X is 1000gu of ship Y? If yes, stop jump of ship Z at 1000gu to ship Y.
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Really the best way I see to do it is to make the edge of the dictor field a dictor, like .1gu of it. When you are in the dictor field it would be like an allied field so you can jump.
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Something like that is the only thing I can think of that would make it work, and that would just be a lag magnet, as the server would have to analyze every jump being made to see if it is going to enter a dictor bubble, as well as tracking every dictor field that is up, and comparing them.. Furthermore, then you could set your destination past the field, and manually drop jump to be dropped out inside of that field.
The people doing DS know more than me on this, I just don't think it would work.. I personally don't see that much of a problem with it anyway, they are paperthin and extremely easy to kill, save the Kluth ones, which if cloaked can't be used offensively anyway.. Increasing energy usage won't work, as they already drain the ICC dictor dry in a minute if the shields are trying to recharge. The only thing I can think of is reduce the field range from 1000gu to 500-750gu. It'll at least stop PJing close enough to alpha strike, they'll still need to cover distane for that, though they will be close enough for cannons and railguns.
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That’s another good idea.
There is one other possibility...
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On 2009-06-21 14:38, Sensitivity wrote:
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On 2009-06-19 12:12, Dr. Fattierob, M.D. PhD wrote:
I think you underestimate just how big a hex tile on a planet is.
And I think you are underestimating just how much "1 power" is on a planet
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1 power is enough to sustain the needs of 10 thousand~ people.. or was it million?
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So how can we have a dictor on a cruiser?
[ This Message was edited by: Fatal Ants *XO* on 2009-11-30 11:56 ]
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Nightsabre
Marshal
Joined: February 21, 2005
Posts: 66
| Posted: 2009-11-30 11:45
It should be easy to check if the point you are jumping to is still within the dictor field you are currently in. If you are then your jumpdrive should not work. But if your jumping out of the field it should let you. This would stop the point jumping from within the bubble.
The most they would beable to do is point jump someone out of the field or on the very edge since it stops you early but if your that far out your already vunerable.
And I think that with the JD disable pulse this would make the Interdictors very useful but not totally kill combat when brought out.
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Sens [R33]
Admiral
Joined: September 27, 2008
Posts: 1020
From: Edge of th...
| Posted: 2009-11-30 16:22
Its hardly a deathtrap, what cripples most fleet is sacaraficing 3 dreads to kill the dictor only to end up facing 3 enemy dreads that are untouched with no armor/shields on 3 arcs and low ammo. Ignore the dico as a dread, let a cruiser or destroyer harass the dico. These ships have roles for a reason.
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Viskel the Muffin Muncher
Grand Admiral
Joined: November 13, 2009
Posts: 38
From: Your Fridge
| Posted: 2009-11-30 19:18
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On 2009-11-30 16:22, Sensitivity wrote:
Its hardly a deathtrap, what cripples most fleet is sacaraficing 3 dreads to kill the dictor only to end up facing 3 enemy dreads that are untouched with no armor/shields on 3 arcs and low ammo. Ignore the dico as a dread, let a cruiser or destroyer harass the dico. These ships have roles for a reason.
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This is what I have been saying the entire time. Dictors are weak and very vulnerable.. Not to mention moving at 20gu/s and having no shields/armor. The only deathtrap is the one the dictor pilot is flying.. I know this from experience.
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Jar Jar Binks
Grand Admiral
Joined: December 25, 2001
Posts: 556
| Posted: 2009-12-01 10:30
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On 2009-11-30 16:22, Sensitivity wrote:
Ignore the dico as a dread, let a cruiser or destroyer harass the dico. These ships have roles for a reason.
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lol, have you tried to kill a dictor with a cruiser or a dessy?
a dread is the only ship thats powerful enough to actually make a dictor run before the dread dies.
a druiser or dessy wont stand a chance at saving a dread that way because the dictor can still dodge well enough.
the only reason dictors die so fast now is because everyone hates them and thus becomes primary target.
i'l gladly sacrifice a dread if it means i get to kill a dictor.
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Sens [R33]
Admiral
Joined: September 27, 2008
Posts: 1020
From: Edge of th...
| Posted: 2009-12-01 18:42
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On 2009-12-01 10:30, Jar Jar Binks wrote:
Quote:
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On 2009-11-30 16:22, Sensitivity wrote:
Ignore the dico as a dread, let a cruiser or destroyer harass the dico. These ships have roles for a reason.
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lol, have you tried to kill a dictor with a cruiser or a dessy?
a dread is the only ship thats powerful enough to actually make a dictor run before the dread dies.
a druiser or dessy wont stand a chance at saving a dread that way because the dictor can still dodge well enough.
the only reason dictors die so fast now is because everyone hates them and thus becomes primary target.
i'l gladly sacrifice a dread if it means i get to kill a dictor.
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Yes, I killed one handily in a gunboat dessie and another in a torp cruiser(both ICC dicos). If the dictor runs, you're doing your job. No one says you have to actually go in the dictor field. Without combat ships, the dictor is useless.
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Sops
Marshal
Galactic Navy
Joined: March 07, 2004
Posts: 490
| Posted: 2009-12-01 21:04
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On 2009-11-30 16:22, Sensitivity wrote:
These ships have roles for a reason.
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They do, but talking in a more general sense one problem that has bugged me about this game is that so many smaller class ships fill an important role in the fleet yet there is very little incentive for a player to use them.
There are a few players that get enough satisfaction out of helping their faction, they are willing to fly a support ship with no other reward but I think relying on these people is a flaw in the game mechanics.
If you are going to give all ships a role in the fleet (which they should) give people some incentive to use them.
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Sens [R33]
Admiral
Joined: September 27, 2008
Posts: 1020
From: Edge of th...
| Posted: 2009-12-02 18:33
Most K'luth players I see would gladly take a smaller ship if it meant turning the tides. As for ICC, they have more than enough players to diversify. Failing to do so is their problem. Again, there is nothing wrong with ignoring the dico entirely. Kill the dreads around it and the dico is nothing but an annoying gnat.
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Viskel the Muffin Muncher
Grand Admiral
Joined: November 13, 2009
Posts: 38
From: Your Fridge
| Posted: 2009-12-02 19:12
I'm one of those ICC players that plays whatever role is needed to have a better chance at winning.
However, the issue is as Sops said it.. There is little incentive aside from 'helping out.' For example; Point-Defense destroyers. They can be very very useful in long-range fights. Especially useful against ICC. I myself have done PD jobs three times; twice defending a fleet around a planet, and once defending a fleet from a planet and its defenders. PD Destroyers are very effective at what they do and I cut the enemy firepower by about 1/4-1/2. However.. I got no pres by the end of it. Being a low-rank player without access to Dreads, pres is sort of something I can't spare too much of. The problem is that for all the PDing I do... I don't get an ounce of Pres out of it.
Supply ships are a very important role (save for Kluth) and there is rarely a situation where there aren't any people willing to fly one.. But then supply ships give a ton of prestige for doing what they do. Combat destroyers give prestige for doing what they do.. PD Destroyers do not. Interdictors do not. There are a few others that don't really give any incentives to be used, so they are most often used by the lower-rank players who have no real option. I have yet to see someone of 1RA or higher rank use a PD Destroyer.
These ships need a bit more incentive, like a little bit of pres for PDing a missile. Not a whole lot mind you, but a little. That way if you are out PDing for thirty minutes, you should be getting some fair pres out of it.
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Eledore Massis [R33]
Grand Admiral
Templar Knights
Joined: May 26, 2002
Posts: 2694
From: tsohlacoLocalhost
| Posted: 2009-12-02 19:42
Idem Dito
I flew a assault Cruiser a hour ago, i used the beams to screen missiles incoming to our fleet and i played a offensive roll when enemy's got close.
I was just defending the fleet while the fleet did the attacking..
Its not that profitable in prestige but the fleet stayed safe..
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Viskel the Muffin Muncher
Grand Admiral
Joined: November 13, 2009
Posts: 38
From: Your Fridge
| Posted: 2009-12-02 21:59
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On 2009-12-02 19:42, Eledore Massis [R33] *NCO* wrote:
Idem Dito
I flew a assault Cruiser a hour ago, i used the beams to screen missiles incoming to our fleet and i played a offensive roll when enemy's got close.
I was just defending the fleet while the fleet did the attacking..
Its not that profitable in prestige but the fleet stayed safe..
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And Assault Cruiser, not a PD destroyer. You used a ship that can also be used as much for combat as for PD. People below VA can't make that choice. They are stick with the PD destroyer which can't fight people off on its own, except corvettes stupid enough to get in laser range, so there is no possibility to get pres from it.
When I came back a few weeks ago (last time I played was years back, when we had ship modding and all), I basically got to Captain rank through building and supplying.. I didn't even bother using combat until Captain rank (that is slightly fixed by the corvette buffs, but none of the other low classes were made attractive) because you barely get any pres for it with those small ships. PD destroyers, which -should- be flown by the low-rankers to protect the high-ranking pilots in dreads, carriers, and stations, give no pres at all.. We need to make these ship classes attractive to the low-rankers as well as high-rankers..
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