| Author |
[SUGGESTION] ICC shield reworking |
Rhiawhyn Zerinth
Fleet Admiral
Templar Knights
Joined: October 31, 2005
Posts: 257
From: I.C.C Deep space refueling station
|  Posted: 2009-02-21 12:32
And this is true, however i am talking about reducing the shields hp, and increase the regen to a rate, where you cannot exactly outdamage it at range, it draws power from a capacitor, alowing you to still take down the shields, get in closer, and you start doing more damage then the shields can regen from, and you start damaging the armor, or hull...
The larger the ship, the faster the regen, you dont add more then a small ammount of hp. aside from the capacitors being larger, you ballance it by making it so tactics are required if you want to bypass a ships shields, by out damaging them, if you dont, you can still break the ships shields with sustained fire, draning the capacitor, and thusly the ships energy.
while yes, it would change the way icc works, right now icc feel like a high tech ugto, with armor that drains power, is weaker, and only has a minor advantage in regen...
aux shield gens would be interesting, but giving the icc three things to pick from, would make interesting choises, longevity in combat? get an aux shield capacitor, increases the maximum shield power "over" 100% by about 10 to 15 per capacitor, at the cost of more power drain when hit. want to take harder hits? add an aux shield gen, takes more shield capacitor power, but reduces the chance of a ship overwhelming an icc ships shields. need more power? aux gen. three different choises, all of them are the same in that not one thing is beter then the other. they all have trade offs that give the icc diverse ways of surviving, as the defence faction should be able to do.
ugto are the all round good faction, can take a hit, and dish it out.
kluth are the guys who hit realy, realy, hard, they just cant take that hit they just threw out there.
icc are the ones who are made to survive, thats what they do. they dont exactly do the most damage, but they SURVIVE, if you want to pew pew and kill things reliably, go ugto or kluth, if you want to have fun surviving, go icc.
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Gejaheline
Fleet Admiral
Galactic Navy
Joined: March 19, 2005
Posts: 1127
From: UGTO MUNIN HQ, Mars
| Posted: 2009-02-21 15:14
Mmm, I generally agree with Rhia's post just there. If anything, ICC should have the most comprehensive set of defensive choices, perhaps including the choice to specialise against different types of weapons (as UGTO does now), with UGTO having much simpler choices such as light and heavy armour (I also recall there being talk at one point of UGTO having "charged" armour, which acted as a poor man's shield, which could be an interesting addition).
While this all would involve a lot of rebalancing and testing, I believe it would give more flavour to the ICC: They'd be undoubtedly the tough-to-crack faction, with UGTO being more generalised slow-tough-and-shooty people.
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Sens [R33]
Admiral
Joined: September 27, 2008
Posts: 1020
From: Edge of th...
| Posted: 2009-02-21 16:34
UGTO is specialised defense, whereas shields are one-size fits all
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Rhiawhyn Zerinth
Fleet Admiral
Templar Knights
Joined: October 31, 2005
Posts: 257
From: I.C.C Deep space refueling station
| Posted: 2009-02-21 16:59
But thats the issue, ugto is not supposed to HAVE specalised defence, thats the iccs job. the DEFENCE factions job.
Ugto, has armor. they have firepower, they dont NEED specalised defences that make them harder to kill. icc need more defence, or a rework of the shield, mostly because the defence faction is getting decimated by the ugto, who has MORE defence. then the DEFENCE faction, see the issue here?
Its not fine, for those who are on ugto. go play icc for more then an hour, and try to kill a ugto ship in a cd. who has alblatives, and then tell me its not overpowered. just because it has drawbacks dose not give it the right to have defence greater the the faction who was built around defence.
Stick with light, standard, or heavy armor. you keep customisation, and you lose the 50% less damage from all weapons if you have both alb and reflective, also try to make more then one sentace posts, i like to see backing behind statements, and explinations.
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Gejaheline
Fleet Admiral
Galactic Navy
Joined: March 19, 2005
Posts: 1127
From: UGTO MUNIN HQ, Mars
| Posted: 2009-02-21 17:09
Quote:
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On 2009-02-21 16:34, Sensitivity wrote:
UGTO is specialised defense, whereas shields are one-size fits all
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UGTO should be generalist defence, with one-size-fits-all. They're not the defensive faction, they should have no complex defensive options. Instead, they should merely be fairly resillient to anything and everything, with no strengths or weaknesses, befitting the hammer-them-until-they-stop-moving UGTO bulldozer tactics.
They charge into close range, dealing lots of damage and taking lots of damage, until their impetus is blunted by running out of armour and/or weapons.
ICC, on the other hand, should have lots of options to keep them alive whilst they grind the point off UGTO's spear with their relatively weak, longer-ranged weapons.
Alternatively, they have the resillience to resist the patented K'luth point-blank beams of death, whereas the UGTO have to rely more on killing them before they themselves are killed.
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Rhiawhyn Zerinth
Fleet Admiral
Templar Knights
Joined: October 31, 2005
Posts: 257
From: I.C.C Deep space refueling station
| Posted: 2009-02-21 17:17
Quote:
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On 2009-02-21 17:09, Gejaheline wrote:
snip
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And i agree, ugto are the faction to go to for steamroller tactics, they can take damage, and they can dish it out. icc cannot dish out anywhere near the same damage as ugto at close range, the main issue here, is that again we fall back to the point where ugto does defence beter then the defence faction, by ways of specalising to the situation making them nigh unkillable, while retaning the high damage output...
It just dosent work, from a ballance standpoint. just because ugto is an allround faction dosent give them the right to be stronger defencivly then the defence faction.
Before anyone says the icc have more hp in the long run, thats just it. the long run never happens because you die so fast as icc, it dosent mater.
ugto and icc should be on par with eachother in the long run, icc should dominate everything in the "here and now" defence, kluth shouldint even bother with trying to weather things like the icc can try to do ((only, right now, the ugto weather more then the icc can))
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Sens [R33]
Admiral
Joined: September 27, 2008
Posts: 1020
From: Edge of th...
| Posted: 2009-02-22 11:08
the point being that a UGTO pilot's chances decrease significantly as the battle wears on.
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Winters Rapture
Fleet Admiral
United Nations Space Command
Joined: December 09, 2007
Posts: 355
| Posted: 2009-02-22 12:00
lol, now if only we could achieve that "as the battle wears on" thing. the battles cant wear on if the UGTO have killed everything and moved on before before any of those negitive effects come about.
It would be nice to see the defencive faction be the defencing faction once again, not just the 2nd class citizen of the UGTO(a weaker clone of UGTO). i really like the idea about rethinging the UGTO armor though, it would make alot of sense, and may remmidy some of the problems that the current armor types currently pose. Anyway, something needs to be done because as things stand we are hardly close to something ballanced.
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Pakhos[+R]
Chief Marshal
Pitch Black
Joined: May 31, 2002
Posts: 1352
From: Clean room lab
| Posted: 2009-02-22 16:16
In game chat.....
/y is ICC coming back for second round?
/y repearing , we will be there soon..
/y it has been 10 mins and u still repearing?
/y Sheild ,dude, shield! takes too long to regain..
After seeing Ugto stations jump at 5% hull and 20% armor to nearest depots/supply platforms we kluth, infact personally I, no longer chase the enemy.... I have witnessed , a station get from 20% armor to 100% armor within 20 seconds...only with its own repair drones and 5 platforms... So i do think ICC has every right to want their own energy system..
But there is a really important point in this game and most of developers negate to see it . Only one faction exists in this game which doesnt need to use energy for it's defense... UGTO. So , every bit of energy they have , they use it for offense...
Ok, i have sent an email to support@palestar.com! I wrote something very interesting that i have never heard from any player . I am sure also devs didnt notice that problem..
It is about enhancements. which are? Weapon and armor enhancements.. what i mean ? ok listen up.
Ugto can mount 2 types of armor . Ablative and Reflective! What does ugto do? They mount 2 types of armor , from each side and each plate.. So they wont have problem if they receive kinetic or beam damage( we dont know what kind of armor is faced last). so far so good.. Now think a ugto with %40 armor enhancements! Means they will get a good boost on both armor type while enemy ship can mount "ONLY" +40% kinetic or "ONLY" +40% beam multiplexer. In anycase, both armor has their own resistence to weapon types , one of them become immune to lasers or to projectables.
Since only we have 2 types of weapon system in "whole" universe , it isnt so hard for ugto to defend theirself.
If i need to resume things :
Icc is right , they need a better shield or energy usage for it . Separete armor enhancemets for ablative,reflective and normal(for icc ,kluth and for standart armor). And i wont finish without saying "give more energy to kluth" ,because dictors are coming back and we will have to stay in battle zone even if we dont want it and we cant keep running cloaked..
sorry for taking over the thread..
Peace.
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Fattierob
Vice Admiral
Joined: April 25, 2003
Posts: 4059
| Posted: 2009-02-22 22:26
Quote:
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I have witnessed , a station get from 20% armor to 100% armor within 20 seconds...only with its own repair drones and 5 platforms... So i do think ICC has every right to want their own energy system..
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I keep saying this, and nobody ever listens to me on it - Limit the number of repair drones that are active on any one ship
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t500
Marshal
Joined: June 20, 2007
Posts: 188
From: vermont
| Posted: 2009-02-23 06:41
how a bow't a Platform that gives you shields?
similar to a Depot.
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Rhiawhyn Zerinth
Fleet Admiral
Templar Knights
Joined: October 31, 2005
Posts: 257
From: I.C.C Deep space refueling station
| Posted: 2009-02-23 08:16
These are all good points, but unlikely to change, anything
The new shield systems will benifit from turning off the shield emiters in terms of regen, the trade off? you lose all defence during this time. te capacitor charges faster, you can get back into battle faster.
as it stands ugto has really no disadvantage, if the enamy is sporting cannons, you go alblative and negate the majoirty of there damage, if they swap to beam heavy ships, you jump out to a friendly depo planet, swap to reflectives, and before you can even recharge your jump drive, you are repaired, and ready to go.
Ugto, is to dang versitile, just like how the tf2 demoman was.
They are not ment to have multiple defence options, the long term never happens, because they do magnitudes greater damage then icc, killing them before that supposed long term shield regen would kick in and make a differnece ((i have yet to see shields suddenly start doing beter, i still lose them faster then ugto loses one plate of armor.)) ugto has at least 5x more armor hp on any given facing, even more so if using alblative and reflective due to the 50% damage reduction for that one damage.
in otherwords, fix the dictor bug, and start working on ballance again, when a game is fun to play for all partys, its ballanced. right now this is wow space and ugto are lvl 70s, while the rest of the people are only lvl 40s and 50s
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Don Nukey of ICC *CO*
Chief Marshal
Interstellar Cultural Confederation United
Chatting in 'DarkSpace English'
Joined: June 05, 2006
Posts: 429
From: Zeebrugge, belgium
| Posted: 2009-02-23 13:10
well said rhia
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Winters Rapture
Fleet Admiral
United Nations Space Command
Joined: December 09, 2007
Posts: 355
| Posted: 2009-02-23 14:55
The Don has spoken, let it be so.
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Sixkiller
Marshal
Courageous Elite Commandos
Joined: May 11, 2005
Posts: 1786
From: Netherlands
| Posted: 2009-02-24 03:36
Quote:
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On 2009-02-23 08:16, Rhiawhyn Zerinth wrote:
These are all good points, but unlikely to change, anything
The new shield systems will benifit from turning off the shield emiters in terms of regen, the trade off? you lose all defence during this time. te capacitor charges faster, you can get back into battle faster.
as it stands ugto has really no disadvantage, if the enamy is sporting cannons, you go alblative and negate the majoirty of there damage, if they swap to beam heavy ships, you jump out to a friendly depo planet, swap to reflectives, and before you can even recharge your jump drive, you are repaired, and ready to go.
Ugto, is to dang versitile, just like how the tf2 demoman was.
They are not ment to have multiple defence options, the long term never happens, because they do magnitudes greater damage then icc, killing them before that supposed long term shield regen would kick in and make a differnece ((i have yet to see shields suddenly start doing beter, i still lose them faster then ugto loses one plate of armor.)) ugto has at least 5x more armor hp on any given facing, even more so if using alblative and reflective due to the 50% damage reduction for that one damage.
in otherwords, fix the dictor bug, and start working on ballance again, when a game is fun to play for all partys, its ballanced. right now this is wow space and ugto are lvl 70s, while the rest of the people are only lvl 40s and 50s
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I don't know what wicked math you use to get the 5x more armor HP on any facing, but its wrong.
We have the same armour, but we have 2 plates. That makes 2x more, and maybe 2,5x more if you count advantages of the different armor types (but not count their disadvantages)
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