| Author |
MV popularity and Frigates |
Eleda
Cadet
Joined: August 03, 2002
Posts: 438
From: Sunny ol England
|  Posted: 2003-10-06 16:39
As we all know the Scenario servers are more popular with many people than the Metaverse. Personally i too have started to feel the pull of the darkside and have found myself clicking more and more often on the scenario servers, giving up the chance to play on the persistant MV in exchange for some instant fun in the servers.
Right there is the important word....FUN. I actually find the Scenario servers fun, something that the MV long ago ceased to be for me. Now when i log on to the MV it feels like a chore, something i am duty bound to do in honour of my Fleet. After a deep long session of soul searching (shopping trip with girlfriend) i think i have discovered why this is for me personally.
The MV is stagnant.
In a scenario server you must go through the process of building a base, consolidating power blocks, allocating defensive and offensive forces, loacting and hoarding the correct resources while silmaltaniously thwarting your opponents attempt to do so.
The MV is I cap.You cap.I cap.You cap.I cap.I cap. You cap You cap I cap etc
The MV lacks the dynamics of the Scenario Server and so becomes a boring repition of the same actions over and over again.Soon the systems in the MV will be added to, which for a short period will limit the boredom and should create a small flurry of interest in the MV.However once these new systems are explored, developed and built up to the full the bordem will set back in.
So how do we add the fun of the scenario servers into the grand scale of the MV?One solution is to continusly expand the MV,adding more and more systems over time.Unfortunatly this can only be done a finite number of times before problems such as limited server power cause things to once again stagnate.
What we need are the planets we have already to be periodically reset to a unbuilt or mostly undeveloped state.The problem is how to do this realisticlly within a persistant Universe.As i see it there are two options that are not mutually exclusive:-
1.RANDOM EVENTS
Asteroid collisions, deadly plagues, seismic disturbances and radiation bursts could all be set up as random events that either totaly or partially destroy the colony on a planet. With damaged planets comes the need to rebuild them and an oppertunity for smaller ships to shine (as they would be able to attack planets quickly when the chance arises and would actually stand a chance against it in its weak state)
2.PLANITARY REVOLTS
Currently a planet will revolt when its moral is low for a long period of time. I would like a more in-depth systems that also has more serious repercussions.
-Overview
Planets would have a loyalty score, ranging from 100 to 0. This is seperate from the moral of the planet. The loyalty score of a planet will constantly fall over time at a rate determined by the planets moral (worse moral equals higher rate of fall).When the loyalty hits 0 the planet revolts (see what this means later).If you think this is unlikely to happen and an un-realistic system remember that all three factions are in a state of political termoil either through over-taxation or inter-clan warefare.
-Loyalty Modifiers
Certain events would cause this score to rise or drop suddenly
Drop:-
Another planet within 100,000 gu Revolting
Another friendly planet within 100,000gu being captured
Friendly ships being destroyed within 10,000gu
Being Bombed
Being captured by a rival Faction
Raise:-
Another planet within 100,000gu being captured/colonised by same side
Enemy ships within 10,000gu being destroyed
Compleation of a patrol mission to the planet by a frigate
Most of these are obvious causes of a fall or rise in loyalty, though the frigate patrol mission might need explaining.
Frigates would no longer get scout missions for enemy planets and scouts would no longer get patrol missions for friendly planets. Frigates are patrol ships, suited for peacekeeping tasks.They are fast enough to catch pirates and inssurectionists while powerfull enough to instill loyalty in planitary governers.Whenever a Frigate compleates a patrol mission to a friendly planet its loyalty is re-set to 75% (unless it is above this). No planet with a loyalty of above 50% could be the target of a patrol mission (remember that other factors could rapidly increase the loyalty )
-Rewards
People would get patrol points for these missions (rather than scouting points).There would be bronze, silver and gold badges. The most popular ships in each faction (whatever they may be after the changes) would require these badges.Patrol points would translate very poorly into prestige..this is grunt work not a fast track to promotion.
Patrol points could be lost.If a friendly planet revolts within 10,000gu of a player they will loose patrol points. Because of this people will be encouraged to do a little bit of patoling even once they have their gold..to keep their score up.
-Consiquences
When a planet revolts it will go through a violent upheval as the revolutionarys battle agianst the people still loyal to the Faction.The following will happen
-The planet will turn neutral
-Every Infantry unit on the planet will have a 50% chance of being destroyed.Those not destroyed will change alignment with the planet
-Every Building on the planet will have a 50% chance of being destroyed
-50% of the resources on the planet will be lost
This could leave the planet crippled or relativly healthy..such are the risks of revolution.
If the planet still has a Starport and a Shipyard after the revolution then every other neutral planet in range will set trade routes TO that planet.The planet would randomly select a combat ship of destroyer size or below of its faction type and once it has the resources for this an AI ship of that type will be spawned.This AI ship would respond to attacks on the main planet or any tithing planets, or once a large enough fleet was formed would attack and bomb other worlds (though never capturing them, just going for damage).
This would happen rarely due to the combination of cirumstances required, but if it did happen and this renigade 'mini empire' was left alone for long enough it could provide a tough nut to re-take.
Patrol work might sound boring, but think about where most of it would take place. Due to the causes of a drop of loyalty patrolling would mainly be required in border systems near enemy factions or renigade worlds. The lone frigate doing his little patrol sweep would often be the first line of defense, detecting and holding the attacking force as best it can while sending an urgent message for help.
Oh well, sleepy now. I would like to write more but i have work in 6 hours and the way my girlfriend is taliking about this new designer bag i think overtime may be needed 
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Tellaris
Grand Admiral
Galactic Navy
Joined: April 30, 2002
Posts: 830
From: Land of Chocolate
| Posted: 2003-10-06 17:41
How I see it is a ship should gain missions based on its type.
For example:
Scouts get Scouting Missions (Obviously)
Frigates would get Patrol Missions (Maybe destroyers too)
Destroyer would get Escourt missions (Their obvious purpose, escourt)
Cruisers would get Escourt missions (The middle class of ship)
Drednoughts would get Defend missions (Planets only)
STATIONS:
The Big change. Currently, stations CAN NOT get missions. What they should get is DEFEND Missions. As a big, slow object, they should get defend missions of the nearest FRIENDLY planet. The timer would last as long as enemy ships were detected within 5000 gu of the planet. Invisible ships would not allow defend missions. These ships MUST be detected.
As for your Neutral planets...
How about they be able to rebuild themselves over time, after revolt? And how about Neut trannies would spawn occasionally, and once enough got together, they would fly to the nearest friendly planet to get inf, and attempt to inf rush an enemy planet. This would mean, if the Neutrals were not taken care of quickly, they could spread, possibly becoming a plague on the MV. And how about letting ALL sizes be possible to spawn? This would allow for harder to kill neutral fleets... Possibly a neutral fleet large enough to plow through whole groups of players. (This would only happen if the neuts managed to conquer a good amount of the MV. Maybe 1/10th of it.) This, in effect, means, that the AI could be a very strong force at one time, if any faction lets it grow out of control. If the AIs own multiple systems, this would allow them to form multiple fleets... Or even gather into one huge fleet. Of course, you would have to make them smarter, and tougher, to prevent them from being farmed. For example, if one is getting ganged up on by 2 or more people, it should run, most players would. (This is an example, and usually only happens when there arn't any allies around)
Of course, it is entirely possible for different factions to cultivate a Neut growth behind enemy lines... Thus distracting them, while enemies make their way through enemy space, caping away...
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The Engineer that could.
[ This Message was edited by: Baikon on 2003-10-06 17:42 ]
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Sardaukar
Admiral
Raven Warriors
Joined: October 08, 2002
Posts: 1656
| Posted: 2003-10-06 17:51
I think stations should get 10/20/30 minute "Service" missions, being payed mucho dinero for operating as a mobile planet (aka what they are) in an engagement or along a deepspace hyper-route to a distant systems. What really gets me is how such a large structure has limited repair drones- limited anything, for that matter. Stations oughta be big, slow, fortresses to take a planets place, with their own special 'construction decks' (i.e. the lower dome-discs on the UGTO and ICC stations, and the dome of the Hive) that can hold, say, 5 or 10 buildings. You may strap on fighter bases, defense bases, mining bases, factories, and starports. maybe even allow scouts and frigates to spawn from the starport(like a minishipyard)  .
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Tellaris
Grand Admiral
Galactic Navy
Joined: April 30, 2002
Posts: 830
From: Land of Chocolate
| Posted: 2003-10-06 17:59
THATS an Idea I like. I've always been in favor of ships being capable of spawning from player ships (Within a reasonable limit, of course)
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Bad_Skeelz
Cadet
Joined: October 18, 2002
Posts: 359
From: The Lobby
| Posted: 2003-10-06 18:09
Quote:
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On 2003-10-06 16:39, Eleda [-IMO-] wrote:
The MV lacks the dynamics of the Scenario Server and so becomes a boring repition of the same actions over and over again.
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I agree, the MV battle lines are for the most part pretty stable, with the occasional collapse due to the faction switch of a fleet or whatnot. So yes, lets put new stuff in to combat the current stagnation of the MV.
Quote:
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People would get patrol points for these missions (rather than scouting points).There would be bronze, silver and gold badges. The most popular ships in each faction (whatever they may be after the changes) would require these badges.Patrol points would translate very poorly into prestige..this is grunt work not a fast track to promotion.
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However, to make the game less repetitive you suggest something that is *gasp* boring and repetitive. No one is going to want to do this, not even newbies since the badge would be of no concern to them (hey they aren't going to be flying dreads for a few months).
Now, I like your idea of faction loyalty and moral going down or up due to certain events. However, 10,000gu is a big distance, clusters are about this size. Maybe a smaller area for enemy ships to be located in should be used, say 5,000gu or so. Also under your system if a planet 100,000gu away revolts then the loyalty of of a planet goes down. 100,000gu, if I remember correctly, is a HUGE distance. I doubt the people on Planet A are going to care if the people of Planet B over throw the current faction, it's not going to affect thier security since they are most likely well behind the lines while Planet B is probably a fringe world. But if Planet C which is in Planet A's cluster (so rather close) then the people of Planet A may freak out. A hostile planet within striking distance (if they can launch ITs at the transport then whats to stop them from launching a PCM into the capital?). So maybe the area for a revolt to affect morale should also be lowered.
Quote:
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The lone frigate doing his little patrol sweep would often be the first line of defense, detecting and holding the attacking force as best it can while sending an urgent message for help.
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This would only be a valid idea if frigates were significantly beefed up, since a lone frigate can't stand up to anything other than a frigate.
On a final note, if frigates boosted a planet's loyalty, shouldn't and even bigger ship boost the loyalty more? I question wether a frigate would even improve moral/loyalty at all, its just some diddly thing that blows up in 2 seconds. A crusier or even a dreadnaught on the other hand, would make me feel safer.
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Sandals
Fleet Admiral
Agents
Joined: January 21, 2002
Posts: 2001
From: Redmond,WA,USA
| Posted: 2003-10-06 18:56
I only like Scenario over MV because ships last longer
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musashi
Cadet
Joined: September 22, 2003
Posts: 24
From: Lincoln, NE
| Posted: 2003-10-06 22:59
@ Eleda, Great Idea. but i agree with Skeels on the point of adding more repetive tasks isnt whats needed. The overall problem is that this game is b4 its time. The Ideas that youve put forth are novel and brilliant, and if i had any say they would be in the MV asap. Id love it if i could set my ship to be on AUTO pilot and have it patrol while i slept, all id have to do is set a flight plan and then fall asleep. To tell ya the truth you should get 2 profiles when you start this game.. One for FA and One for MV (IMHO). but ive begune to rant.. anyway good post.
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From dust to dust....
[ This Message was edited by: Not Falling on 2003-10-06 22:59 ]
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Gideon
Cadet
Joined: September 14, 2001
Posts: 4604
From: Oregon, USA
| Posted: 2003-10-08 12:51
Alrighty, first thing you should know is this:
Random events, exatly such as these, are actually already a functioning part of the game code. They were turned off a long time ago, for no reason that I can really recall at this time. 
Suffice it to say, re-including such things is actually a very easy process at this point (though would occupy some additional time, so will not be concidered until v1.482 or later). We do plan to reintroduce random events into the MV after v1.481.
Soooo....
Lets hear some very specific suggestions detailing each random event you suggest. Since we are going to do this, and a great deal of the work for them is already in the game code, then that frees up you having to make broad suggestions. Make specific ones, with numbers, ratios, and everything. Go crazy with it.
On missions: Missions are slated for a major overhaul, partly involving the random events and also partly to implement a player driven mission system. This would take time away from coding the server on v1.481, so is schedualed to be implemented over the course of several patches. Probably initially starting with the re-introduction of random events.
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