| Author |
The Answer to Balance |
Demorian
Fleet Admiral
Galactic Navy
Joined: October 06, 2001
Posts: 3406
From: Charlotte, North Carolina
|  Posted: 2003-08-16 01:04
It's been alluded to before, it's been skimmed in posts all long, uberlong, short, and one-lined... but I don't think any one post has ever been devoted to it. The answer to everyone's fights about capping, recapping, etc, lies in some subtle changes to weaponry and armor and such, sure... but what we're really talking about is incentive.
This is a game. Incentive to play is everything, and a DarkSpace player's incentive is Prestige. Let's face it... you don't get a lot of prestige for building nowadays, and that's not even the half of it.
Any faction that's well organized and has the right numbers can go on a rampage in one or two enemy systems (or the entire territory of an enemy). They will make mountains of prestige from destroying defense forces and from bombing planets to dust, crippling trade.
...and how does this this mirror the recapping force's task?
With the exception of some decent building prestige (if only two to four people are rebuilding the system), you get no prestige for re-establishing trade routes. You get no prestige for stabilizing economies and other forms of planetary management.[/b]
The mountains of prestige are to offensive forces as the molehill is to the re-establishment forces. That is what plagues so many of us... undoing what damage has been done yields no reward when it should.
I'm not saying it's all prestige, but it's DEFINITELY incentive...
Players need a reason to recap their systems and rebuild. They need something to look forward to, whatever it may be.
...just a few cents.
-Dem
_________________
|
Quistis {C?}
Cadet
Evil Empires Inc.
Joined: April 06, 2002
Posts: 1536
| Posted: 2003-08-16 01:30
Couldn't say it better myself Dem...
_________________
|
-=Arch=-
Cadet
Joined: July 10, 2002
Posts: 214
From: *CLASSIFIED*
| Posted: 2003-08-16 01:38
Demorian
I dont know what your trying to say here, or what your point is (Maybe cuz its late and Im tired). But why do you insist on trying to come up with a clear cut "Balance" idea.
I thought for sure that you and everyone else on the "Balance" bandwagon would take into count the current events, and realize that there cant be a magical "Balance" patch that make everything all better.
If anything, it proves that no mater what you do, unless you have an active, coordinated and team based faction ..... absolutely nothing you do to the game will make it "Balanced"
I offere these examples, Im using PB just for the fact that we are VERY Active, and proves my point Im trying to make. The fact that we are UBER is another point all together .. LOL, j/k ... well ... not really .. he he
PB as Kluth - Peaple complained that the Kluth were overpowered and that they needed to be adjusted for Balance. Months and Months of forum posts forced us to prove it by moving to the other factions to prove a point.
PB leave Kluth and head to UGTO - Kluth space falls for the first time in DS history - Forum has lots of UGTO need to be adjusted for balance posts. FLUX, FLUX and more " I HATE FLUX" Posts than ever. Just go back in time on the boards and youll see where Im going with this.
PB return to Kluth - kluth space expands, UGTO activity dwindles, ICC advance with the addition of BIS.
PB leaves Kluth and heads to ICC - ICC Wipes out UGTO in 3 days, hold all UGTO Space for 2 and work on Kluth and the same time. The Pulse wave posts, AC Nerf posts are a flying.
The key point im trying to make here is ACTIVITY, ACTIVITY ACTIVITY...... NO MATTER WHAT YOU DO, UNLESS YOUR IN THE MV IT WONT MATTER !!!!!!
Dont get me wrong, Im not flaming you ...... Ive just come to the reality that there isnt a darn thing you can do to make everyone happy. If you want the MV to be fun ..... cull your fleet, recruit active members and spend more time killing in the MV than sitting in the lobby/FA and just writing about it.
My point to all this Dem ...... there is no "Answer to Balance" ....
_________________
|
MrSparkle
Marshal
Joined: August 13, 2001
Posts: 1912
From: mrsparkle
| Posted: 2003-08-16 01:41
Yep. There's a lot involved in balance.
I'm gonna include my own thought here: play times. I think that's another area that hasn't been touched on much.
In a persistant online, combative world the advantage always goes to the side that can wage an effective war during off-hours (off-hours are generally considered late night US time). It's a simple truth really. I've seen it in other persistant online games, most notable Dark Age of Camelot where one team for a while had a large European community that would play late-night and wreak havoc before morning when the other two teams would start logging on.
There was so much arguing and bickering and downright nastiness over these late night players and how they were ruining the game, well I left I couldn't take it.
Now, I'm not saying DS is turning into DAOC at all. I'm not saying everyone's complaining about late night players. But the fact remains that the faction that has the most late night players will have an advantage. It's not wrong, it's not right, it's lucky. We are seeing it right now. The ICC dominance is not just about the players they acquired, it's also about the time of day they play.
There is no harder obstacle to overcome in this type of game than differing time zones. Remember that and maybe we can all tolerate each other a little better (and keep the bickering/boasting to a minimum).
_________________
|
Stracius
Cadet
Joined: February 26, 2003
Posts: 96
From: Denial
| Posted: 2003-08-16 02:11
Hey Arch, try reading the post next time before you go off on a rant  . Dem's topic is somewhat badly labeled (possibly to just grab your attention), but seriously, I'm wondering if you didn't reply in the wrong thread by mistake... You and he are just two different subjects all together. It's confusing now.
Why must you confuse me. Why. Why
_________________
|
DOM700 [-IMO-]
Fleet Admiral
Joined: July 26, 2001
Posts: 3175
From: Eckental, Germany, Sol-System
| Posted: 2003-08-16 02:17
Alright, I help taking BD, I got 200 prestige...that's nothing, I simply think combat prestige is too high, it should maybe be one third, making it useless to send ships on suicide missions and gain prestige meanwhile
_________________
If the buildings on your planets disappear, guess who was there....
Never forget what you fight for
I have earned my betatester badge for being part of the open beta
![Email DOM700 [-IMO-]](http://www1.palestar.com/gamecq/phpBB/images/email.gif)
|
DaMadCow
Fleet Admiral
Joined: July 20, 2001
Posts: 407
From: A Farm
| Posted: 2003-08-16 03:12
need i point out that when PB came to UGTO, Plus BSS and GTN's reassurgence no one was wiped?
_________________
|
g0ds s0ldier
Grand Admiral
Pitch Black
Joined: October 24, 2002
Posts: 954
| Posted: 2003-08-16 03:17
Cow, ICC or Kluth werent wiped b/c not everyone had the same goal, some people wanted to attack kluth all the time, some chose to fight over Luyten for a week...if we all would of been on the same page we would of ruled like we did in the first couple days...
_________________
Pitch Black
|
Tbone
Grand Admiral
Joined: July 21, 2001
Posts: 1756
From: Vancouver
| Posted: 2003-08-16 03:27
Quote:
|
On 2003-08-16 02:11, Stracius wrote:
Hey Arch, try reading the post next time before you go off on a rant . Dem's topic is somewhat badly labeled (possibly to just grab your attention), but seriously, I'm wondering if you didn't reply in the wrong thread by mistake...
|
|
What he said. You on the same page as some of us?
_________________
|
NightDragon
Cadet
Joined: May 26, 2002
Posts: 893
| Posted: 2003-08-16 03:32
its not prestige, some people think you can get prestige way too quickly already, so the scales of the promotions needs to be changed, becauseonce you earn FA whats teh point in playing? you dont "need" any more prestige, the only prestiege you need is to be able to SD your station on top of some ships to get more presteige back
need to add more ranks, more ships and really more choices for weapons, and some time int eh future all that will happen
_________________
\"Experience is a tough teacher. She gives the test first and the lesson after.\"
~ William H. O
|
Strategery
Grand Admiral
Sundered Weimeriners
Joined: December 07, 2002
Posts: 522
From: Straight Outta Boston!
| Posted: 2003-08-16 04:18
Quote:
|
PB leave Kluth and head to UGTO - Kluth space falls for the first time in DS history - Forum has lots of UGTO need to be adjusted for balance posts. FLUX, FLUX and more " I HATE FLUX" Posts than ever. Just go back in time on the boards and youll see where Im going with this.
|
|
EXCUUUUUUSE ME! I seem to recall the ICC taking down the K'luth prior to that little PB-UGGY campaign. Check your history...
http://www.darkspace.net/phpBB/viewtopic.php?topic=17691&forum=1
ICC PWNZORZ YOU ALL!!!!!!! (forgive the childish l33t speak) 
_________________
[S.W] Grand Admiral Strategery
ICC Master Battle Strategist (ret.)
Proud Commander of the C.S.S. Ticonderoga
|
Dwarden
Admiral
CHIMERA
Joined: June 07, 2001
Posts: 1072
From: Czech Republic
| Posted: 2003-08-16 04:52
i want point out there is definitely not enough of players to full test balance anymore, until you get 30:30:30 players at once , playing full scaled fleet war ... IN ONE TIME FRAME ...then you cant anymore test balance...
and 1:1 or 2:2 is not 10:10 or more ...
EoF
_________________
... Ideas? ... that's Ocean w/o borders !
|
Darksworde
Marshal
Pitch Black
Joined: September 06, 2002
Posts: 806
From: The Zoo
| Posted: 2003-08-16 05:27
Well said Dwarden. At this present time, we do not have the numbers to truly comment on ship balance.
The situation at current stands at.
If low numbers and a system is undefended, the ICC will cap very quickly, followed by the Kluth and UGTO.
If low numbers and defended, the ICC and Kluth will both cap quickly, whilst UGTO lag behind.
If high numbers and not defended, each faction can cap very quickly, but ICC hold the advantage here
If high numbers and defended, UGTO have the advantage, followed by ICC and finally kluth.
Due to the current player situation, this swings the advantage towards the ICC and Kluth. Hence why both factions appear to have the upper hand.
_________________
Live by the sworde, die by the sworde
|
Demorian
Fleet Admiral
Galactic Navy
Joined: October 06, 2001
Posts: 3406
From: Charlotte, North Carolina
| Posted: 2003-08-16 10:16
@Arch...
Relax. I didn't read your entire reply, but I got the gist of it, and what some of the others said was right. My topic was badly labeled. I wrote it at 2 AM and I was kind of rambling.
I DO think my idea is connected to some of the complaints about what players call "balance". That is what I intended to say... but what my post is really all about is the drive to play all fronts of DarkSpace.
Wakarimashita ka?
-Dem
_________________
|
Lith Ragond
Cadet
Galactic Navy
Joined: November 25, 2001
Posts: 1854
| Posted: 2003-08-16 10:21
i agree demo...
wait a minute... i just realized something, demo has more posts than i do... ARRRGGGHHH!!!
_________________
|
English
Deutsch
Nederlands
)
