| Author |
Forcing client sync |
Fluttershy
Fleet Admiral
Joined: September 24, 2011
Posts: 778
From: Fluttershy
|  Posted: 2012-06-26 21:19
Very often players will experience a problem where data takes extremely long to update, or never does at all.
The work-around for this is going into F3 and clicking on a planet far away.
Another temporaryfix is to re-log.
If we could have a "sync client" button, it would make this a little more direct, and use less bandwidth so you aren't loading distant information, and then loading local information again.
To avoid over-use and excessive bandwidth, this should probably have a delay of 10 seconds per use.
Some symptoms of this problem are as follows, experienced by myself and many many others (Most, if not all, never even make posts about it... only complaints in game.)
-Taking damage from an invisible source
-Jumping to a location and nothing being able to be targeted
-Offloading resources, and the number not updating for a lengthy time.
-Jumping out of a battle, and suddenly taking a massive amount of damage a minute later.
-Being able to clearly see hiding K'Luth that have an undamaged cloak.
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Hakketak
Grand Admiral
Joined: March 24, 2009
Posts: 301
| Posted: 2012-06-27 04:25
that button is impossible:P the client alrdy synchs each person every once in a couple of seconds. its just that the connection speed and latency is different for person A, compared to person B. If person A has a sick internet connection and person B is using a 52K dial-up connection, its impossible to synch person A with B.....Person A is pretty muhc up to date with the server (lets call the server the actual reality of the game) so experiences anything on it pretty much realtime. Person A fires a gun, the server calculates how it should fly, the gun hits the target.
now Person B. Person B is flying around. the server sees him in a position and goes to tell the pc of person B where it should render a vessel on the map to show location of person B. unfortunatly, person B gets the message from the server after 5 seconds..In these 5 seconds, person A jumped person B and alpha'd 2 times.
Person B is flying around, all happy and joyous. All of a sudden someone named Person A jumps up behind him. Person B sees all these guns and beams coming at him, so decides to e-jump. Unfortunatly, by the time person B decides to e-jump, thinking its 2 seconds after he got jumped, in the server world he is being shot at for 7-8 seconds alrdy. So person B sends a command to the server to e-jump. it takes 5 seconds to reach that message to the server. Unfortunaly, Person B died.
That is how it seems to be happening. Now the only way we can all be in synch is if everything is buffered for a minute, so in that minute corrections can be made. But during this minute, nobody can move. So we have to reduce the size for the buffer of correction, but to small nothing can be corrected, to big and we all have huge lag...
having a Synch button would cause huge lag
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DiepLuc
Chief Marshal
Joined: March 23, 2010
Posts: 1187
| Posted: 2012-06-27 05:11
Quote:
| On 2012-06-27 04:25, Officer Pantzoffski wrote:
Person B is flying around, all happy and joyous. All of a sudden someone named Person A jumps up behind him. Person B sees all these guns and beams coming at him, so decides to e-jump. Unfortunatly, by the time person B decides to e-jump, thinking its 2 seconds after he got jumped, in the server world he is being shot at for 7-8 seconds alrdy. So person B sends a command to the server to e-jump. it takes 5 seconds to reach that message to the server. Unfortunaly, Person B died. |
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I have many experiences with this situations. All of what Officer spoke are true.
Clicking F3 on a far away - actually on another system - is not a true way to sync yourself. When you read a planet, it takes time for the server to send the information to you; in thus time, your client syncs information. In general, you must wait for your client to update the situation.
You usually desync when you're orbiting a planet. The best and safest way to sync is to dock to SY.
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Forger of Destiny
Chief Marshal
We Kick Arse
Joined: October 10, 2009
Posts: 826
| Posted: 2012-06-27 05:16
Quote:
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On 2012-06-26 21:19, Fluttershy wrote:
If we could have a "sync client" button, it would make this a little more direct, and use less bandwidth
To avoid over-use and excessive bandwidth, this should probably have a delay of 10 seconds per use.
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+1.
while the client's automatic sync and resending of data works for many people, it would be nice to have a manual control for doing the same when the client is not enough.
sync achieved in this manner would be only a temporary fix, but desync is best corrected with temporary net boosts, similar to how diabetes is cured through small and temporary medicine doses (of insulin)
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Pantheon
Marshal
Palestar
Joined: May 29, 2001
Posts: 1789
| Posted: 2012-06-27 06:50
The client syncs everything every few seconds. The replication system we added literally copies the data of all nouns that have changed and sends them down to the user.
Adding a manual button will do nothing. The reality of it is that we cannot fix the internet, and the exact reason given a few posts above is why very few companies do real time calculations and tracking these days; almost all outcomes are pre-determined by a dice role, which makes spending CPU time on complex interpolation algorithms much easier.
The server is what ultimately decides everything, so even if one player has 5 seconds worth of ping, if the server has received your data about you moving, any damage that player does whilst he thinks you're right next to him won't be dealt. The client does full simulation, so whilst it looks like his projectiles and beams have connected with a ship, the server will simply be firing those projectiles towards a location where nothing is, dealing no damage. That client will update whenever his replication is received (usually once every few seconds), and the player will magically disapear or speed off.
I'm sorry it's not perfect, but again, this is why VERY few games do things like this, and the ones that do spend years tweaking and trying to perfect their netcode that's usually not much better.
Even though it looks nothing like it, and plays nothing like it, DarkSpace is more like Counter Strike (game by VALVe) than you can imagine, and if you've ever played that you know exactly what I'm talking about.
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Fluttershy
Fleet Admiral
Joined: September 24, 2011
Posts: 778
From: Fluttershy
| Posted: 2012-06-27 11:00
I would like to be able to see my "lag shadow", basically where the server sees me, and how other players see me, its placement would be adjusted by ping.
We implemented such a thing on another game.
You could toggle between seeing your smoother moving client self, or the servers portrayal.
Look at the way vehicles are typically handled in some of those FPS games.
You may notice that the controls tend to be laggy and sluggish, thus, you do not actually see a response to your turning or speed changes and whatnot until the server actually updates you.
This behavior more or less makes what you see very well synced with what other people see.
If you aren't receiving or sending any data, you will simply carry on with whatever course of direction you were taking, without the client still allowing you to maneuver.
[ This Message was edited by: Fluttershy on 2012-06-27 11:05 ]
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Pantheon
Marshal
Palestar
Joined: May 29, 2001
Posts: 1789
| Posted: 2012-06-27 16:31
Quote:
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On 2012-06-27 11:00, Fluttershy wrote:
I would like to be able to see my "lag shadow", basically where the server sees me, and how other players see me, its placement would be adjusted by ping.
We implemented such a thing on another game.
You could toggle between seeing your smoother moving client self, or the servers portrayal.
Look at the way vehicles are typically handled in some of those FPS games.
You may notice that the controls tend to be laggy and sluggish, thus, you do not actually see a response to your turning or speed changes and whatnot until the server actually updates you.
This behavior more or less makes what you see very well synced with what other people see.
If you aren't receiving or sending any data, you will simply carry on with whatever course of direction you were taking, without the client still allowing you to maneuver.
[ This Message was edited by: Fluttershy on 2012-06-27 11:05 ]
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Not realisticly viable - would double network overhead, and we're already shunting quite a bit of data around. If you have crap internet and you live significantly far away from the server, you're going to have a bad day.
Each game is different, and whilst it may work in another game, it doesn't mean it works in all games.
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Fattierob
Vice Admiral
Joined: April 25, 2003
Posts: 4059
| Posted: 2012-06-27 16:43
Quote:
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On 2012-06-27 16:31, Pantheon wrote:
If you have crap internet and you live significantly far away from the server, you're going to have a bad day.
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NoBoDx
Grand Admiral
Joined: October 14, 2003
Posts: 784
From: Germany / NRW
| Posted: 2012-06-28 03:20
@flutter: you missed the extreme out-of-sync times where you had to relog to get back in sync
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Hakketak
Grand Admiral
Joined: March 24, 2009
Posts: 301
| Posted: 2012-06-28 04:24
lol fattie good pic:)
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