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New shield Quadrants---or Octants! |
AdmBito
Grand Admiral
Sundered Weimeriners
Joined: October 04, 2002
Posts: 1249
From: Its hard out here for a pimp
|  Posted: 2004-09-11 01:37
With the upgrade coming to shields, and the extra layer of shields being added, why not add a layer of detail/depth to shield reinforcement? I envision adding 4 more quadrants, for a total of 8, to make reinforcing shields more precise.
As it is now, in a large ship during a turn, for example (one of many), getting hit near the border of one of the quadrants will waste power and damage both quadrants. This seems like it makes sense, but to reinforce the shields, why waste all that power for an entire quadrant? I think it should be a bit more precise, so you can get shields restored only where they need to be.
I have heard through the grapevine about added shielding layers across the board for the factions, espeically the big ships. As they are now, they get hit once of twice, they lost they shielding, which is their primary means of defense. With this added shielding, and a few extra quadrants to adjust shield power to, it will be a bit easier to recover from attacks.
As it would be adding to an already steep learning curve, (and, in all honesty, do scouts, frigates, or destroyers need 8 shiled arcs?), I would think this would only be limited to dreadnaughts and stations, and maybe cruisres, though that might need to be tested. The theory being that noobs cant fly dreadnaughts, and certainly not stations, so they may be ready for an increase in their shield arcing---also, it may give them something new to look forward to.
Anywho, I'm running out of steam, it's late, I'm sure I'll have something to edit/add ot this. Please, give me comments, flame it, add to it....oh, and like my artwork?
Bito
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[ This Message was edited by: AdmBito on 2004-09-11 01:39 ]
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Meko
Grand Admiral
Joined: March 03, 2004
Posts: 1956
From: Vancouver
| Posted: 2004-09-11 01:59
Bito: As your personal idea Filter i decree that this is a
i may be unaffilliated, but i started ICC for a reason, and this would make me tempted to just stay there =)
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Grimith
Grand Admiral
Templar Knights
Joined: August 09, 2003
Posts: 836
From: Your local future farm.
| Posted: 2004-09-11 02:06
This is pretty good stuff, Bito. I definitely like it. Despite your typing impediments (y'know, since you aren't the best at English and all), you've come out with a rather nice idea.
And, yes, that's great artwork. 
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Fatal Green
Cadet
Joined: July 02, 2003
Posts: 72
From: California
| Posted: 2004-09-11 02:12
Bito your artwork is awe-inspiring. The detail, the passion, your dramatic flair, it all shows. I've never seen a piece as detailed and amazing as that that could be done in less than twenty seconds. It almost even beats the artistic quality of finger-painting five-year olds.
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Hellza - Dark Master
Fleet Admiral
Praetorian Wolves
Joined: June 06, 2004
Posts: 498
| Posted: 2004-09-11 02:53
lmao @ fatal. but i do think shields should be stronger. i think weaponry should be heavier also, like a EAD or bigger should be able to destroy scouts with 1 blast and destroy frigates with 1-2 blasts.
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Chromix
Cadet
Joined: June 29, 2001
Posts: 3052
| Posted: 2004-09-11 03:00
The more you split up the shield quadrants, the higher is the chance for a torp to hit multiple shield arcs.
Currently we have 4 arcs, a torp may sometimes hit 2 arcs at one. So image we split this to 32 arcs. The explosion would hit 5 arcs at once, leading to even more power drain.
The "problem" are the damage calculations. If a torpedo does 2000 damage, then it does so to everything it hits. And if it hits multiple objects, each object will be damaged by 2000 points. The damage is not divided up between the hit objects.
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Meko
Grand Admiral
Joined: March 03, 2004
Posts: 1956
From: Vancouver
| Posted: 2004-09-11 03:28
chrom..... maybe thats a bad idea. the whole idea of shields its to absorb damage, so when hitting a shield close to its edge, wouldnt it diffuse the torps blast, or at least deflect it...
i mean i dislike the idea that a torps blast can damage two shields at once, it gives the attacker too much and the defender not enough.
i dunno, i just like the idea of torps hitting one shield and concentrating all its power on the one shield and not the spread
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Novacat
Grand Admiral
Joined: October 30, 2001
Posts: 2337
From: Starleague Cache
| Posted: 2004-09-11 07:10
After hearing Chromix's explination, I think I would have to go with Chrom. 4 Arcs are better.
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Gideon
Cadet
Joined: September 14, 2001
Posts: 4604
From: Oregon, USA
| Posted: 2004-09-11 10:58
Chromix is correct.
This is fully within the realm of possibility. However, if we are to do so, we would need to go through and re-design a bit of the power suppy/demand matrix for ships. Also, a subtle change that would be nessesary, would be a change to the display of shield/armor HP on a ship (the colored rings).
Not impossible, and certainly a bit of work that is within even my limited abilities.
The real questions are these:
1 - Does this improve game play, or just make it more complicated?
2 - Is the payoff worth the effort?
3 - Can we come up with a better use for these four keys (numpad 1, 3, 7, and 9)?
4 - What level of demand does the community have for this?
5 - How does this interact with future expansions to game play?
Now I'm not going to answer all of these questions. I'll leave that for you guys to mull over.
However, this concept does bring up the idea of also reducing the number of arcs on smaller ships. For scouts, you could have just two 180° arcs, one for forward and one for aft.
It does raise some interesting possibilities, and bares remembering.
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[ This Message was edited by: Gideon on 2004-09-11 10:58 ]
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Grimith
Grand Admiral
Templar Knights
Joined: August 09, 2003
Posts: 836
From: Your local future farm.
| Posted: 2004-09-11 12:14
Well, now that Chromix has conveniently ruined how good I thought this idea sounds, I will have to withdraw my vote of approval for it. Sorry, Bito, but if the additional shield arc thing means that my precious Command Carrier stands a greater chance of dying, then I will have to say, "Nie!"
On the other hand, that is still great artwork...
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Linna Yamazaka {Vice Admiral}
Vice Admiral
Raven Warriors
Joined: May 03, 2003
Posts: 415
From: killer
| Posted: 2004-09-11 13:45
I think with a little reworking to were the torp damage is slpit over the shiled arcs it hit will be a good ideal. I have sugested the eight shiles arc ideal before and it was flamed into dust. I hope that does not happen with this ideal. Let us go forward and explore IN DETIAL what needs to be changed to make this new eight arc sheild plan work.
The lest should be done to try the ideal of more sheilds for the larger ships. The scouts can have the two for and aft arcs, frigates and dessies have full, fore and aft, Cruiser have fore, aft, port and starboard. As for the dreads and stations they should have port fore, starboard fore, fore, port , starboard, port aft starboard aft and aft. Trasports should have aft, port, fore, and starboard, and a full shield giving to the heavy trasport. Engerneers should also but like the trasports. Supply ships shouls have fore, aft shields BUT with two layers of shielding. As for the ships that have no shielding K'luth and UGTO replace shileding with armor placements.
This should be something that is looked into with great detail and see IF it can be worked into Darkspace. And as You may notice the shields or armor goes up with the ships the biger the ship, the more protection it recives.
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Axianda The Royal
Fleet Admiral
Terra Squadron
Joined: November 20, 2001
Posts: 4273
From: Axianda
| Posted: 2004-09-11 16:13
Quote:
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On 2004-09-11 10:58, Gideon wrote:
The real questions are these:
1 - Does this improve game play, or just make it more complicated?
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It will probably make it more complicated, where we now use keypads 2,4,6,8 for the foward left right and aft shields and 5 for the full shields we would need to put in 4 more keys for the extra directions which can be a pain to manage even if its 4.
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2 - Is the payoff worth the effort?
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well thats interesting, yes it takes a lot more time to learn however the ICC ships would get 2x more shield power storage due to the fact they have more sections to divert it from, which in theorie should give them more defense power
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3 - Can we come up with a better use for these four keys (numpad 1, 3, 7, and 9)?
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Perhaps shortkeys for the more AI related things....
for instance 1 and 3 are fighter controls, 1= escort me, ALL fighters on the field will come running back
3= target nearest threat, ALL fighters on the field will get a new target
7 and 9 i dont know yet
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4 - What level of demand does the community have for this?
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Right now I myself would rather NOT see this happen, its to much hassle to learn right now, instead focus on making the current shields stronger which are being done 
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5 - How does this interact with future expansions to game play?
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Bringing more challenge to that game? im not sure
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Coeus {NCX-Charger}
Admiral, I can't read,
Sundered Weimeriners
Joined: February 16, 2004
Posts: 3635
From: South Philly
| Posted: 2004-09-11 17:26
Quote:
| 1 - Does this improve game play, or just make it more complicated? |
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Yes to both and no to both. It makes things more complicated for ICC players, and it makes it possible to do damage across a larger number of the shields for uggies & kluth.
As far as the complicated issue, I've got two things. 1) I played Cosmic Rift for years with the number pad (8, 2, 4, 6 thrust reverse turn L & R - 5 turbo forward - 7, 9 strafe L & R... etc) and I adapted very quickly to the shielding system - even still it took some practice, especially with the camera locked on target. Point being, that with a little practice anyone can come to be as deft with the octogonal shielding as with the quadrogonal (spelling not required!).
Just like every other feature in the game, if it is implimented in a balanced way then it can drasticly improve the complexity of combat. If done incorrectly though, it could have the same effect as any other unbalanced mod/feature. With the shields there is a unique effect on ICC because it will either make ICC way too powerful or way too weak. As it stands, shields are already at somewhat of a loss because of energy leaching weapons IIRC (or did this change before I got back?).
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| 2 - Is the payoff worth the effort? |
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That entirely depends on the result. I would love to have more quadrants of shielding to draw power on when facing off with 1 attacker - with 2 or more enemies things could get quite dicey and make the thrill even more. The payoff depends on how this is implimented & any other changes.
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| 3 - Can we come up with a better use for these four keys (numpad 1, 3, 7, and 9)? |
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The idea about the fighter controls are interesting - but there are plenty of keys on the keyboard for that. As it stands - I don't use the display controls that are currently assigned to 1 3 7 and 9 and find it VERY annoying when I accidently hit one of these keys without looking & go to find that a display that I need is missing. I honestly can't think of anything else for the numberpad - but I do ask this...
To Uggies & Kluth - what would YOU like to see on the number pad?
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| 4 - What level of demand does the community have for this? |
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Depends on how many "former UGTO" players have an interest in the shielding. I for one would love to see this level of complexity added to the gameplay (especially about how different class ships have different shielding & all that). Can the devs or admins or something make a poll on the main page?
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| 5 - How does this interact with future expansions to game play? |
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That depends entirely on the developers. I've heard the rumors that some shield love was coming but don't recall hearing any details. This may be some encouragement to have weapons changed so that they deal out proportional damage across quadrants of shielding/armor (EG: torp inpacts right on the fault line between starbord & aft shields, both shields take the equivilant of a full torpido each now - when it should do about 50/50 damage to each, or maybe 60/60 damage to both - have an increased damage to the shields if it impacts on a fault line which would semi-balance with the reduced damage per shield & the possibile 8 section shielding).
This brings out the possibility of further enhancing the differences between the ships of a same class & different classes - and with the possibility of shields being added to each faction there is the chance of more variation in shields.
For example - having a type of shield that recharges VERY fast but doesn't offer a lot of protection, and a shield that offers a lot of protection but doesn't recharge quickly or something. I dunno. Gotta block party to goto, please debate! 
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Midnight *FA*
Fleet Admiral
Terra Squadron
Joined: April 29, 2002
Posts: 689
From: ICS. Idot (ICC Station) somewhere in the middle of nowhere
| Posted: 2004-10-10 18:37
I like the idea personaly.. I recall back in the days of Starfleet command the shields had 6 divisions.. it accualy made combat very nice because you could turn your ship to take damage in a stronger region of shielding.. sometimes damage spilled over granted but it made for more tactical thinking on the attackers part.. You just had to manuver your apponent so you could hit the weaker archs.
All it takes is a small addition to the coding that would say this much hit this portion and this much hit this one... Most of the time if your capable enough you can really make good use of the extra sections, I belive it would add to the combat experience greatly.
a few tweeks to armor/shield ratings (yes apply this to armor to) shields being the main concearn because of energy reqs. im sure some new calculation could be devised..Maybe reduce the absorbion by a little since you have 6 sections to work with, keep the power demand like it is accept devided into 1/6s and the benifit is slightly faster recharge. Just a sujestion anyway.
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0mni
Grand Admiral
Joined: March 09, 2004
Posts: 288
From: Canada, Lived around the world.
| Posted: 2004-10-10 20:06
Me like big um power thing, bring more complucated to dun game. Bring hep o fun
-PK
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