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Its the numbers, not the in-game tech balance. |
Distel {Combat BUMpkin} Stolz
Cadet
ExtraTerrestrial Space Bums
Joined: April 04, 2003
Posts: 85
|  Posted: 2005-08-30 15:51
(Or is it?).
Number of UGTO fleets ranking in the top 10: 2 (two)
Number of active (paying) players in those two fleets: 40 (Galactic Navy) + 54 (Courageous Elite Commandos) = 94 players
Number of ICC fleets ranking in the top 10: 5 (five)
Number of active (paying) players in those five fleets: 31 (The Raven Warriors) + 9 (Synchronicity) + 20 (Space Warriors) + 37 (Fatal Squadron) + 35 (Killing Elite Squad) = 132 players
Number of K'Luth fleets ranking in the top 10: 3 (three)
Number of active (paying) players in those three fleets: 19 (Pitch Black) + 13 (Evil Empires Inc.) + 9 (The Three Amigos) = 41 players
To Sum it all up:
K'Luth (as a faction) are outnumbered nearly 2.3 to 1 by the UGTO, 3.2 by the ICC, and by 5.5 to 1 by both human factions.
Possible conclusions that can be drawn from these figures:
1. UGTO and ICC players are more dedicated to DS as a game than players who chose to play K'Luth.
2. Playing K'Luth is inherently more difficult and playing UGTO and ICC is inherently less difficult, which means most DS players gravitate towards the path of least resistance.
3. There is an imbalance in the game itself which either forces players who play the K'Luth faction to either stop playing (and paying) or to switch factions for improved (more enjoyable) game play.
None of the above conclusions is wholly correct prima facie.
The first conclusion is undoubtedly true...UGTO and ICC players are more dedicated to Darkspace as a game than most of those who have played K'Luth; but why are they? Very simply put (and the only reason anyone would be dedicated to a MMOG) is that they receive intrinsic pleasure from playing the game...they enjoy the time they spend playing; if they didn't, they would go elsewhere.
This also holds true for the players who choose to play the K'Luth faction; obviously they are not enjoying their game play as much as those who play UGTO and ICC. So they are not playing (and paying) in greater numbers (they are going elsewhere).
The second conclusion can really only be supported by analogy or testimony from players, and is therefore difficult to substantiate. At this point in time, the K'Luth faction is very definitely an underdog...and this does make it more attractive to some players (a few only), as it is more difficult to persevere against overwhelming numbers and that does make for more difficult game play (a challenge some might say). Very few people, however, choose to have their "play" resemble "work", and will avoid game play that is so structured.
The third conclusion is often a subject of heated debate within these forums. It is a subject rife with subjectivism and opinion and, because of that, it is very difficult to make any statements about balance that can be universally accepted as unbiased or objective.
The only objective statement that can be made is that in the last year and a half, the two most populous K'Luth fleets (Evil Empire Inc. and Pitch Black) have seen either their fleet membership decrease by half, or have had close to half their fleet membership decide to stop playing (and stop paying). It could be argued that the people who decide to play K'Luth are of a different mind set than those who play UGTO and ICC, and simply have become bored of the game itself and have decided to move on.
Statistically speaking, however, people who choose to play MMOGs are probably (used as a statistics term here) of very similar mind-sets rather than dissimilar...as those who are of different mind-sets do other things than play MMOGs (there are quite a few people out there who don't even know what a MMOG is, by the way). So something else is at work regarding the reduction in K'Luth player numbers.
Why then are there fewer K'Luth players than there were a year and a half ago? And as a corollary to that question, is a slow death to the K'Luth faction (due to an ever decreasing player base) a good thing for Darkspace as a whole?
Please note, if you respond, that I have tried to be impartial. I do not Role Play this game, so I don't think of myself as a "Lobster" or some disgusting alien (as some people do and are more than willing to indicate). I do not have particularly negative thoughts about either the UGTO or ICC. UGTO, ICC, and K'Luth are simple interface name tags that give some in-game substance. I would love as much as the next Darkspace fan for this game to continue to be successful and enjoyable for ALL of the player base...it just doesn't seem to be accomplishing that task very well at the moment.
Instead of focusing on player factions, it might be much more productive if players stepped outside of their faction point-of-view and looked closely at the current game dynamics...how can we as players help to make this game more enjoyable for everyone?
I keep coming back to this game, as a K'Luth player exclusively (but before that, a player of Darkspace), hoping that game play will have improved for me...Two Weeks(TM) is about the most I can handle and then its just not fun anymore...for many reasons. I would really like Palestar to make it fun for me again so that I feel less like Sisyphus and more like Dionysus.
And even if I have to pay for a month to get two weeks of satisfying game play, I will probably still keep coming back...the potential of this game is enormous and I keep coming back to see how it has improved. But potenial unrealized is wasted energy, effort, and money. And that needs to be addressed by the players, staff, and developer.
Peace and happy game-playing to all.
Cya in several months when I need my two week fix again 
[ This Message was edited by: Bumstel Stolz on 2005-08-30 15:54 ]
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Enterprise
Chief Marshal
Raven Warriors
Joined: May 19, 2002
Posts: 2576
From: Hawthorne, Nevada
| Posted: 2005-08-30 16:02
From a statistical point of view, one could argue the numbers. However, game tech concludes otherwise.
People have switched to ICC and UGTO, because they refuse to adapt to a Kluth more balenced than it was - however - the Kluth faction has more bugs which impair its ability to play correctly, and with the inviting prospects of other faction prestige gaining, the general reason why people have switched is to gain more, faster.
K'luth, actually indeed, used to harbor the most dedicated players (anyone remember 1.480?), they dispeared entirely with the comming of 1.483, when Kluth stopped provided the insta-gib ability it has sustained for quite a long time.
The reason Kluth is an underdog is two fold; bugs which hinder its performance, and people who refuse to adapt for the time being, both understandable, but it is mostly based on game tech.
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Why then are there fewer K'Luth players than there were a year and a half ago? And as a corollary to that question, is a slow death to the K'Luth faction (due to an ever decreasing player base) a good thing for Darkspace as a whole?
Instead of focusing on player factions, it might be much more productive if players stepped outside of their faction point-of-view and looked closely at the current game dynamics...how can we as players help to make this game more enjoyable for everyone?
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There are fewer K'Luth players indicated by the above, it truely is game imbalences - for that it can be seen as some older Kluth fleets have swtiched to others for the prospect of easier prestige, and thus, a more fun, if not advantageous time.
Thos who have looked at game dynamics see, while numbers play a large role, you must have to make player factions able enough to be fun enough to play on - hence, a balencing of tech.
-Ent
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Arcanum {C?}
Cadet
Joined: June 25, 2005
Posts: 222
| Posted: 2005-08-30 16:06
Balance is a key word here. Balance is good. Over-balance is bad. Under-balance is bad.
In all factions.
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Bobamelius
Grand Admiral
Galactic Navy
Joined: October 08, 2002
Posts: 2074
From: Ohio
| Posted: 2005-08-30 17:03
Your numbers aren't necessarily accurate, because even players who have been unsubbed and inactive for a long time will retain their rank.
To get a more accurate number you'd probably have to look at the Last Login, although again that doesn't mean actual gameplay.
Just an interjection...
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Lark of Serenity
Grand Admiral
Raven Warriors
Joined: June 02, 2002
Posts: 2516
| Posted: 2005-08-30 17:06
i can tell u right now Raven is probably only half active, taking top10 fleet numbers doesnt get u newhere
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GothThug {C?}
Fleet Admiral
Joined: June 29, 2005
Posts: 2932
| Posted: 2005-08-30 19:10
and im really the only active Fatal Squadron member at the moment the rest of FS only come on when its convienient for them however most of UGTO/ICC are Faction hoppers from the Kluth and as an ex-Luthy myself i can tell you that kluth weapons arent powerful like they used to be and we have paper thin armor/hull so why bother staying kluth when you can have Bricklike armor for UGTO and have Shielding like ICC 
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Koda
Marshal
Fatal Squadron
Joined: August 29, 2002
Posts: 1384
| Posted: 2005-08-30 20:16
1, DS still needs work
2, DS IMHO needs some kind of Player Balance
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BackSlash
Marshal
Galactic Navy
Joined: March 23, 2003
Posts: 11183
From: Bristol, England
| Posted: 2005-08-30 20:44
Quote:
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On 2005-08-30 17:03, Bobamelius wrote:
Your numbers aren't necessarily accurate, because even players who have been unsubbed and inactive for a long time will retain their rank.
To get a more accurate number you'd probably have to look at the Last Login, although again that doesn't mean actual gameplay.
Just an interjection...
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Agree'd
Your math is very wrong. Less than half of GTN play, and I dont know about CEC... but when I was with then, less than half of them played.
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Diabo|ik
Grand Admiral
Joined: August 16, 2002
Posts: 327
From: Quebec, Canada
| Posted: 2005-08-30 22:21
What Ent said... The K'luth faction has seen it's playerbase migrate over to more playable factions, for that I agree. The reason being that you can't possibly achieve the 3 following objectives when playing K'luth right now...
1st, gain pres ( or at the VERY LEAST , get even ) next to impossible atm ( and this is coming from the only player who didn't see a pres problem when 1483 went live, every other good pilots I knew had lost massive amounts of pres ( more than 3k pres in a few days only ) while I made some 1.5k for a few days, then lost it a few days later to eccm pinging, beacons and cannon spamming ).
2nd, help the faction out ( defend, sacrifice oneself when necessary, etc... ) you don't want to do that since you don't want to lose MORE pres for STUPID ( bugs, imbalances issues ) reasons.
3rd, fun, and while for most people ( I hope so ), like me, a bigger challenge = more fun, ( while an impossible challenge = frustration mostly, and that is the case right now ) I can also see that a lot of players just want to have it easy for their own reasons ( faster, easier pres for bigger ships or personnal *cough* "fullfillment" *cough* ).
And as you can see... People left the impossible challenge ( for them atm, some couldn't enjoy flying K'luth back in 1481, for some of them it was 1482, 1483 just put the last nail in the coffin and made the core of the faction flee to unsubingness or another home ( Exathra or Earth ) ) when it came to them that they couldn't be up to it. I was up to it until 1483, even when all the others were losing massive pres and yet, I STILL got bored of this. Why? Nobody wants to have to deal with bugs AND imbalances at the same time, one or the other, ok, both, no way.
I enjoy a GOOD challenge, but I despise being checkmated before I even made my first move... it's bad for my karma.
[ This Message was edited by: Diabo|ik on 2005-08-30 22:32 ]
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$yTHe {C?}
Grand Admiral
Sundered Weimeriners
Joined: September 29, 2002
Posts: 1292
From: Arlington, VA
| Posted: 2005-08-31 01:07
One thing I'd like to clear up.
Space Warriors has *2* MV active members. Thats it. And I think my information is a little more credible than some bloke looking at the fleet page, as I'm a Fleet Admin.
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Valerius{DK}
Grand Admiral
Joined: August 03, 2001
Posts: 595
From: Island of Zealand
| Posted: 2005-08-31 07:07
Quote:
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On 2005-08-31 01:07, $yTHe {Ret.} wrote:
One thing I'd like to clear up.
Space Warriors has *2* MV active members. Thats it. And I think my information is a little more credible than some bloke looking at the fleet page, as I'm a Fleet Admin.
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Get back in line noob, you arent playing so dont post
But yes, atm we have mere 2 active MV players:
Uberbrooksie, Guardian of Cheese
Valerius, Destructor of Cheesyness
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Sixkiller
Marshal
Courageous Elite Commandos
Joined: May 11, 2005
Posts: 1786
From: Netherlands
| Posted: 2005-08-31 08:01
cec has between 20 and 25 active members.
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Pharoh
Cadet
ExtraTerrestrial Space Bums
Joined: March 17, 2004
Posts: 21
From: Metaverse
| Posted: 2005-08-31 08:02
Well when I first subscribed to this game I chose to play the Icc, I thought there dessies and cruisers looked really cool. Then after a while I had joined UGTO.. then for health reasons I left the game entirely..
When I returned I rejoined UGTO for a couple of weeks and joined KLUTH and have never looked back. I now have a lot more fun than I ever did. Even with the problems that plague the game I do not think that the KLUTH are dead. The players in $BUMS$ are some of the most dedicated that I have seen.
And many of you know ... I am a thorn is a few of your behinds  and the game mechanics still doesn't stop me.
The Kluth faction presents new challenges for most of its players. The way of fighting is unique.
3 Kluth cruisers can easily take down a station and a couple of dreads to boot. I know cause I've done it with other players.
Secret to this Faction is Teamwork teamwork and teamwork.
Now you wander what my point is. Well even with the problems that we are facing as a faction we always and I mean always come back and kick your butts twice as hard. Imagine what we will do when these problems are fixed. I hope you all have a place to Hide !
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Azreal
Chief Marshal
Joined: March 14, 2004
Posts: 2816
From: United State of Texas, Houston
| Posted: 2005-08-31 21:28
Point of pride:
PB is in the top 10. May I see the hands of active PB please? Wolf is fairly active with only 17 members and in the 11 slot. I believe Evil is in there as well? These guys are nowhere to be found. So using fleet rankings is certainly flawed.
Azreal
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