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 Author Cloaking update...
Comet
Fleet Admiral
Pitch Black


Joined: May 30, 2009
Posts: 29
From: Aboard I.W.S. Sitina
Posted: 2012-05-20 12:40   
Tbh I dont see the need to have anti-cloak weapons now. Unless ofc ships can still be cloaked for a long time (while moving at moderate speeds) like they used to be able to without losing energy.

I also prefered it before with pinging, I didn't see what was wrong with it personally :/
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CM7
Midshipman
Faster than Light


Joined: October 15, 2009
Posts: 1812
Posted: 2012-05-21 18:48   
imho, this has done nothing to balance cloak.

Kluth have perfect intel, positioning, and first strike now. When the first strike is over, they can just cloak again, and change course. No need for jumping away.

No more fear of positioning yourself in the middle of an enemy fleet to wait for the perfect time and position to strike,

no more fear of afk cloaking.

No more getting detected as you shipyard camp.

No warning for the small ship sitting in formation.

No more fear of the boarder cruiser.


Of course, you limited the ammount of damage kluth can dish out as well with energy restrictions. Thatd the only drawback.


Im not saying it dont work. Its just different than im used to. And abit lopsided if you ask me. Thank jack for cloak timer.

You can still blind fire on them as well.

I cant think of a better way.... Sorry.

i do know i had no problem with the way it used to be.

If anything, kluth are even more survivable now. no early detection, no post attack detection, and no ability to track them whatso ever.

Yes, with the old system, defiance and opposition, afroman and point of no return, could track kluth even if they cloaked at the end of their jump. Thanks to pnr's sencor plat grid.
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Silent Threat { Vier }
Marshal
Anarchy's End


Joined: August 03, 2004
Posts: 278
From: Waiting...watching...
Posted: 2012-05-21 23:02   
Quote:

On 2012-05-21 18:48, Defiance*CO* wrote:
imho, this has done nothing to balance cloak.

Kluth have perfect intel, positioning, and first strike now. When the first strike is over, they can just cloak again, and change course. No need for jumping away.
Of course, you limited the ammount of damage kluth can dish out as well with energy restrictions. Thatd the only drawback.


Im not saying it dont work. Its just different than im used to. And abit lopsided if you ask me. Thank jack for cloak timer.

You can still blind fire on them as well.

I cant think of a better way.... Sorry.

i do know i had no problem with the way it used to be.

If anything, kluth are even more survivable now. no early detection, no post attack detection, and no ability to track them whatso ever.



One thing you seem to be forgetting, my friend, is that the cloaking device can now be damaged and quite easily in my opinion. K'luth are fragile, it doesn't take long for them to start taking system damage and cloak seems to always be one of the first to go. Even with it at 98%, Kluth can be seen thru it.

Now more than ever, it is often wise for a k'luth ship to jump out after it's attack rather than to try to cloak. When fighting K'luth, I prefer them to cloak rather than to jump because now I know there is a good chance I can force them out of it, not to mention that he is helpless at the time if he cannot get himself lost quickly. Personally I think K'luth are dying more than they used to.

Also now if a K'luth is forced to jump away, go after him because there is a good chance that he cannot cloak at the end of his jump, at least not perfectly.

Remember too that if a K'luth has no energy left and then cloaks, he will damage himself. Right after an attack a cloaked K'luth often has to move quite slowly in order to prevent that damage.

I have been fighting against K'luth a good bit recently so I'm not just saying all this from a K'luth perspective but from a human factions also...
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CM7
Midshipman
Faster than Light


Joined: October 15, 2009
Posts: 1812
Posted: 2012-05-21 23:26   
always appreciate your pov bro. perhaps some kluth playtime is in order
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339,144

Kenny_Naboo
Marshal
Pitch Black


Joined: January 11, 2010
Posts: 3820
From: LobsterTown
Posted: 2012-05-22 05:47   

What Silent said. I know I've been skewered a few times in a planet's dico after running outta energy or having my cloak shot out from under me.

That said, Devs are gonna increase the effects of ECCM on cloak. Which is fine with me. But ECM has gotta be fixed first so that it doesn't reveal our position while cloaked.


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G@lenThor
Vice Admiral

Joined: October 20, 2008
Posts: 2
From: Some where out here.
Posted: 2012-09-10 04:57   
My sujjetion is if the cloak is such a big problem ... allow it to be eliminated if players so wish not to deal with this, ( cloak power drain system malfunction) allow the cloak device to be switched out for a defencs upgrade (such as a armor skin giving 50 percent more def seeing as luth armor is weak anywhey) - that equals the ugto / icc firepower , turning a stealth only ship into a more effective combat able ship, i would also sujjest a anti counter ship able to beachhead sensor rich environments. like player abuse sensor bases.

i like the power loss idea tho forces the craft to be more agile , drawbaks i see many no other platform has to worry about power drain, for example 5 ugto ships head out and ssek out the one single lone ship and harvest him for pres forcing the player to quit playing.

i do not like the possibility of a anti cloak system allowing a over powerd heavly defended ship to take out stations through cloak. (ugto dreads- a bias ship design to witch there is no cure for. the ship design was made to counter large destroyer fleets, but that not what people use them for)

i get that the power idea was implimented to allow a fair advantage for thoes that fly low ships that cant take a hit, should have heavy cost and be avaliable for thoes that buy cred.

i still think that a mission system should be reinstated giving player payment for services to the server, is mining and so forth clearing planets and such, and givn credit alow the use of new systems not just give it to people alow them to earn it. (anti sensor / cloak) making it more difficult not just rank rank is easey if you have a marshal to farm for you by the party option.

for example i unload 50000 dark mater onto planet it pays me 5 credit (cloak costs 500000 credit , that cannot be bought with cash) i understand pople wil dissagree with this due to they like to just shoot each other, it would make the game way more appleasing more difficult and would carry the rank system quite well.

i know i will get alot of complaint here on this but allowing people to upgrade ships based only on rank and planet resources was a huge mistake that should be looked into. it would not only even out the play field but having to pay for ammo repairs would make dog fights less frequent , and huge battles more often. would make system take overs and player abuse lower.

what i would like to see is payment for specil options , armor upgrades past the base of the ship , allow more specialized ranking (example i like carriers so allow for advanced ship upgrades for thoes that only fly ships of that type allowing for more specialized construction of craft and armor cause once your found your dead even by a lower class faster ship to witch you have no repulse to. seeing as once a ship close to 100 gu you cannot fight bak no fire power available on missle craf all you got is missles no short range defences.), more specialized ship construction, and a higher difficulty. ai is boring make ai seek out lone ships lone planets and allow for trade bloking ( allow people to stop trade forcing planets to stop collecting mass quantities of res making getting out ships that can rip right through a whole fleet. dread class and up to marsh from being built.)

look i disagree to what has been done on this server in the past 6 years. i like the free to highest grade. nd the you have to buy cred to have upgrades that exceeed normal upgrades, i do not agree with only one kind of upgrade and the only one kind of ship and only one kind of class you can have.

personally im not a combat flyer, and missleing people for 5000gu out is noobish,
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G@lenThor
Vice Admiral

Joined: October 20, 2008
Posts: 2
From: Some where out here.
Posted: 2012-09-10 05:13   
and one more thing ive been thinking about this... what about making players decide a race once they pik that they cannot choose another , cannot change sides, cannot play bolth sides or many. make a player choose between mining , construction, repair , combat and electro warefare. make for specialized items, and more player based skills. if you fly a destroyer all you can fly is that destroyer it gets destroyed you pay to fix or start over.

forcing people to gang up on eachother and learn how to play more tactical than just another shooter. just another space game that people pik up cause thier mad and want to take it out on someone. witch happens to be the new player joe shmoe that says why am i playing this bias game and sys f this and deletes it. make it so higher classes can not pik on small ships make people that shoot at smaller ships degrade pres forcing them to fight thier own ships... and make the fines heavy and inexcappable.

i know you plyers that like to forceably make people stop playing you may think is fun ( y your server got haked firstly) and secndly ied imagine were tired of being gang beat cause they were new. and saw no other opton....


what say you?.


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Diabo|ik
Grand Admiral

Joined: August 16, 2002
Posts: 327
From: Quebec, Canada
Posted: 2013-03-10 13:27   
Personnally, I think the old system of being able to hotswap an ECM for a Reactor in space was the best. You could use the ECM while cloaked and swap for the reactor when uncloaking. It then becomes a matter of pilot choices and ingenuity over system limits. Makes battles more about wits then fits.

Right now, after a few days of pew pewing. My feeling is that it's all about enhancements and fits and that the wits/smarts have been mostly taken out of the equation.

I'd rejoice if we'd come back to the old wits over fits system, but I won't be holding my breath.

Still a fun game nonetheless. No others like it!

Edit: OOPS, just noticed this is 3 months old XD. Sorry! Move people, nothing to see here!
[ This Message was edited by: Diabo|ik on 2013-03-10 13:31 ]
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Mostly Retired.

Died~2000~Deaths[+R]*CC*
Chief Marshal
Army Of Darkness


Joined: February 08, 2010
Posts: 540
From: Spokane WA.
Posted: 2013-03-15 02:00   
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=orK45-lDPJU
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ADmiraLMaXimus (Bringer of Doom)
Chief Marshal
Praetorian Wolves


Joined: March 09, 2002
Posts: 354
From: Earth
Posted: 2013-08-29 21:16   
maybe there should be a separate reactor just for the cloak with a power gauge just like the one for power now but separate. to let us know how much cloak power we have left and keep the other reactors separate from cloak energy usage.


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  Email ADmiraLMaXimus (Bringer of Doom)
Pantheon
Marshal
Palestar


Joined: May 29, 2001
Posts: 1696
Posted: 2013-08-30 09:15   
Why do that when it works perfectly fine as is?
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Borgie
Chief Marshal
Pitch Black


Joined: August 15, 2005
Posts: 2256
From: close by
Posted: 2013-09-02 00:50   
Quote:
On 2013-08-30 09:15, Pantheon wrote:
Why do that when it works perfectly fine as is?



becuase right now it really doesn't work as is. current layouts with dreds and there local ecm, doesn't allow for friendly ships to fly close to each other to help cut down on sig. also with the extreem high energy useage of the cloak system, it makes cloak more of a hinder on luth combat then a useful tool.

in areas where there is no negitive sig cloak drains at full speed with a 13 ish sig being masked, was roughly around 3.5 energy per second on a dred. while a dred with its power reserves could handle running cloaked at full speed for long enough to get in to striking range, but by the time it got there its power was down to about half, giving us less time for fire on the enemy. with our lower armor (organtic at 69k, and chit at 85k) puts luth at a disadvantage.

while i do feel cloak should have something in return for being perfect in the sense that enemy ships can't ping,but its currtent form is too much.
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Kenny_Naboo
Marshal
Pitch Black


Joined: January 11, 2010
Posts: 3820
From: LobsterTown
Posted: 2013-09-02 22:21   

Cloak drain does seem a little high. Even in deep space with no ECCM effects and with the ship still, it drains pretty fast. IMO, it shouldn't do this. There should be at least a low base speed (say ard 5 Gu/s or so) that the ship should be able to travel without drain.

Otherwise I foresee K'luth gameplay will simply be cloak in, fire once or twice, then jump out. Pretty pointless IMO.
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Forger of Destiny
Chief Marshal
We Kick Arse


Joined: October 10, 2009
Posts: 826
Posted: 2013-09-03 12:08   
Quote:
On 2013-09-02 22:21, Kenny_Naboo wrote:
Cloak drain does seem a little high. Even in deep space with no ECCM effects and with the ship still, it drains pretty fast. IMO, it shouldn't do this. There should be at least a low base speed (say ard 5 Gu/s or so) that the ship should be able to travel without drain.



the idea behind it is that you are invisible to everything in the game, including pirates, MI and admins not logged on the K'Luth faction. its not fair to be able to indefinitely hide yourself forever.

there should be a drain at 0 speed, strong enough to overpower the engines and reactors, and even some ECM effects. there is no fine line between high energy drain and a drain that can just overcome base energy regen (talking about ships belonging to same class). so, the drain is high to be on the safe side.

also, energy capacity is now much higher than ever before, so even with 3 energy drain your Mandible can cloak for a fairly long time (i call 3 minutes long). ofcourse, you can team up with some EWar scouts/frigates or even a EWar cruiser and enjoy the feeling of your v1.67 cloak drains. one Antenna corvette can hide plenty of ships over a good range (900 gu radius), while your EWar cruiser can support 2 dreads/3 cruisers/6 destroyers at upto some 1500-2000 gu radius.

ofcourse, if you e-jump at a low energy, you will get caught by pursuers who can wait your energy reserves out, or use Area ECCM to make you bleed.

though, i do think the current drain could be reduced by 10-20%. also, it shouldnt be possible to achieve negative energy drain with suffiecient ECM (Antenna has enough).
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-xTc- ExisT
Chief Marshal
Army Of Darkness


Joined: March 20, 2010
Posts: 527
From: Red Lobster
Posted: 2013-09-03 15:39   
Look at it this way.

Humans now MUST field PD focused ships or else their fleets will be shredded by missles.
K'luth are practically immune to missles, so why have humans field a particular type of ship when kluth doesn't?
Our cloaked energy drain is set much higher, so we MUST field EWAR ships with lots of ECM to keep our energy at a more optimal combat level.
AND we have an EWAR advantage: Our ECM continues to run while we cloak, while the targeting variants of human ECCM lose their target when we cloak.
I think it wont be that bad as long as kluth has some dedicated ECM ships nearby.


With that said, I do agree that energy drain while cloaked could be reduced a bit.
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