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[FAQ
Forum Index » » Beta Testing Discussion » » new team AI
 Author new team AI
Doran's Stepdaddy
Admiral
Templar Knights


Joined: August 07, 2005
Posts: 466
From: Dorans Basement
Posted: 2008-12-14 22:23   
ok, so i got on the beta after the most recent update and tried out the new Team Ai thing, where if no ones on the server adds AI ships to fight.

i was in my gunboat destroyer and fought an AI k'luth claw, a pirate destroyer and t500 in a pirate engineer.

in short, the AI's combat system sucks

in long, it was to easy to kill them. i was fighting my ships K'luth analog and i killed it as easily as i would a frig. it took each AI a whole minute to realize it was being shot at and when it did the ships would just fly in circles and would fire only if you were in front of it. i don't know if it's just the ships i was fighting or not.

I know AI can't be as good as real players but really, they could be much better.

on another note, i think the K'luth weapons are still a little over powered. Those AM torps on the Claw would take out half my armor in one volley. Is this intentional?
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Hellza - Dark Master
Fleet Admiral
Praetorian Wolves


Joined: June 06, 2004
Posts: 498
Posted: 2008-12-14 23:26   
aye, they still being worked on
practice makes perfect.
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Winters Rapture
Fleet Admiral
United Nations Space Command


Joined: December 09, 2007
Posts: 355
Posted: 2008-12-15 11:57   
idk, i really enjoyed the action we can now have in beta. now when we wanna test something or just have some good combat, beta is the perfect place. i will say the AI could use some refining, but other then that, its all really fun.
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-Shadowalker-™
Admiral
Galactic Navy


Joined: September 23, 2007
Posts: 708
From: Shadows
Posted: 2008-12-15 13:41   
Quote:

On 2008-12-14 23:26, Hellza Clause - Dark Master wrote:
practice makes perfect.



Wrong, practice dose not make perfect. Perfect practice makes perfect.
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Faustus
Marshal
Palestar


Joined: May 29, 2001
Posts: 2747
From: Austin, Texas
Posted: 2008-12-15 13:45   
Quote:

On 2008-12-14 22:23, Beastkiller wrote:
ok, so i got on the beta after the most recent update and tried out the new Team Ai thing, where if no ones on the server adds AI ships to fight.

i was in my gunboat destroyer and fought an AI k'luth claw, a pirate destroyer and t500 in a pirate engineer.

in short, the AI's combat system sucks

in long, it was to easy to kill them. i was fighting my ships K'luth analog and i killed it as easily as i would a frig. it took each AI a whole minute to realize it was being shot at and when it did the ships would just fly in circles and would fire only if you were in front of it. i don't know if it's just the ships i was fighting or not.

I know AI can't be as good as real players but really, they could be much better.

on another note, i think the K'luth weapons are still a little over powered. Those AM torps on the Claw would take out half my armor in one volley. Is this intentional?



I hear ya, but I've got real concerns about making it too smart... it becomes less fun when fighting an AI that is unbeatable.

So building in inperfections is a very important part of AI programming...

Anyway, haven't really done much to the combat AI except give them a chance to jump out when their hull get's below 50%.

-F

[ This Message was edited by: Faustus on 2008-12-15 13:45 ]
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Fattierob
Vice Admiral

Joined: April 25, 2003
Posts: 4058
Posted: 2008-12-15 17:12   
Quote:

On 2008-12-15 13:45, Faustus wrote:

I hear ya, but I've got real concerns about making it too smart... it becomes less fun when fighting an AI that is unbeatable.



I would love to see an unbeatable AI for darkspace. It'd be a measurement of skill.
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codenemesis
Admiral

Joined: June 10, 2007
Posts: 185
Posted: 2008-12-15 21:14   
Two times as invincible deathstar anyone?
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Doran's Stepdaddy
Admiral
Templar Knights


Joined: August 07, 2005
Posts: 466
From: Dorans Basement
Posted: 2008-12-16 11:18   
ok, so today is a Snow Day and the schools are closed (YEA!!!!!!!) so i thought i'd try the beta again

The AI did a lot better today, but it did seem that all the AI always spawned at on area, the locks core cluster in the Ross 148 system.

thus their was a gigantic Ai vs. AI battle their with all 3 factions AI fighting.
but the K'luth AI had a dread their that was owning all the littler ships. one problem i did see was that when fighting in a cluster the AI runs into the planets a lot. it's like they don't even see them their.

on a better note the AI suppy do sup their allies. i found that if i needed a sup i could just go up to one and it would sup automatically. Also the AI CHASED me across the system at one point. i was fighting a krill and 2 dessies in a Gunboat Dessie and when i started losing hull i E-jumped away. 20 seconds later the entire force jumped to me and starting trying to kill me agian. that was cool, even though after i E-jumped again they didn't follow again.

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Leonide
Grand Admiral
Templar Knights


Joined: October 01, 2005
Posts: 1553
From: Newport News, Virginia
Posted: 2008-12-16 11:35   
they will always follow you if you E-jump away.
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  Email Leonide
Enterprise
Chief Marshal
Galactic Navy


Joined: May 19, 2002
Posts: 2576
Posted: 2008-12-17 06:37   
Quote:

On 2008-12-15 13:45, Faustus wrote:

I hear ya, but I've got real concerns about making it too smart... it becomes less fun when fighting an AI that is unbeatable.

So building in inperfections is a very important part of AI programming...

Anyway, haven't really done much to the combat AI except give them a chance to jump out when their hull get's below 50%.

-F





AI in itself comes with its own imperfection: predictability.

Whereas human players can outwit each other, AI is stuck doing whatever you tell it to.

No matter how smart you make an AI, a human player has a way of resorting to ingenuity that an AI just can't match. So in effect, you'd just wind up making them smart enough to be competitive. Its as good as they'll get no matter what in my opinion. So far in MMO's, AI is always sorely lacking when it comes to challenge.

Which adds to yawn factor, which makes it feel more like grinding than fun.




-Ent
[ This Message was edited by: Enterprise on 2008-12-17 06:39 ]
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BackSlash
Marshal
Galactic Navy


Joined: March 23, 2003
Posts: 11180
From: Bristol, England
Posted: 2008-12-17 10:41   
Afaik, Chromix designed an AI that is yet to be beaten. Not even the cream of the cream of DarkSpace could beat it. Unfortunately, it had so many checks it used insane amounts of server processing time, and hasn't been used/seen since (and won't, do don't ask).

AI's there to fill a basic need for some presence of some form in the MV. If's not there to build perfectly, supply perfectly, bomb perfectly, capture planets perfectly, or surprisingly, fight perfectly.

We will try and not make them fly into the planets like lemmings to a cliff, and have varying difficulity (make it challanging). But they were never designed to be perfect, or anywhere near the same as fighting a real living, breathing person.
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deathblave
Marshal

Joined: October 10, 2007
Posts: 268
Posted: 2008-12-17 14:15   
should be an inpossible mission to see if ds players can beat the unbeatable ai just a thought when i haer unbeatable i try to beat it no matter what
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Enterprise
Chief Marshal
Galactic Navy


Joined: May 19, 2002
Posts: 2576
Posted: 2008-12-19 04:25   
Quote:

On 2008-12-17 10:41, BackSlash *Jack* wrote:

But they were never designed to be perfect, or anywhere near the same as fighting a real living, breathing person.




AI shouldn't replace players, which was the point. Then we'd just be like every other MMO out there. It would be unfortunate to see DS reduced to another grind fest for the sake of boosting the player base with a ton of carebears.



-Ent


[ This Message was edited by: Enterprise on 2008-12-19 04:37 ]
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